From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? 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Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bogus@does.not.exist.com Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: bogus@does.not.exist.com () Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bogus@does.not.exist.com Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: bogus@does.not.exist.com () Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? 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Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bogus@does.not.exist.com Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: bogus@does.not.exist.com () Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? 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Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From bogus@does.not.exist.com Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: bogus@does.not.exist.com () Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941462672.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941465823.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941452517.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941469374.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941471287.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941472367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473044.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473999.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474464.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474585.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474922.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941476481.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941477859.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941480317.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941491719.0 From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941499680.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941522905.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941523205.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941524250.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941554787.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941557367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941582605.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941583340.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941584316.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941590746.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941596443.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941558338.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606447.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606915.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941586635.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638397.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638716.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941639118.0 From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941653830.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941640261.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941641712.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941643053.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941644195.0 From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941647813.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941650678.0 From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941657735.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941667055.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941659760.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941719891.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941731328.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941734351.0 From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941754102.0 From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941757733.0 From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941761033.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941783582.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941758645.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941812725.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941810469.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941832235.0 From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941834028.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941838613.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824117.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824439.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898084.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898301.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898761.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941903168.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941910076.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941950718.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941951318.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941935394.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941989286.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941999562.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941976791.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942020429.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942024100.0 From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942033624.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942038189.0 From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942042060.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942018292.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075397.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942076263.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077608.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077867.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942079149.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942084703.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942086111.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942087147.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942088150.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942078790.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942094654.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942105737.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942112540.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942113605.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942114992.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121892.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075920.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942119268.0 From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942120748.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121172.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942155029.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942156048.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942160670.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942169558.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942175989.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. 942198419.0 From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942207215.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942211940.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942212787.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213084.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213126.0 From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233409.0 From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238694.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238939.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942239108.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233949.0 From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942281535.0 From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942284932.0 From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286620.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286277.0 From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942300692.0 From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942287768.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942297508.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942324808.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942347724.0 From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942345401.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942375043.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942376061.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942378769.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942381142.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942383894.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942384376.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942388935.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942389519.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942415271.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942455628.0 From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942438704.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942470270.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942459896.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942490469.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942510626.0 From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942495638.0 From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942513663.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942523028.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942526124.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942540987.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942585327.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942586705.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942590578.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604022.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942601044.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942602165.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942605547.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942609530.0 From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604589.0 From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942614659.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942622248.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942631821.0 From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942646845.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942678502.0 From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942702620.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942709566.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942714052.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942704109.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942716869.0 From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942718292.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942730598.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942721079.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942731420.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732046.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732164.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732405.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942738722.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942760532.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942762299.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942765299.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770385.0 From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770227.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942773600.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942775804.0 From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942790728.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942793942.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942795649.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942797486.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942798168.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942811188.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942799702.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809469.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809615.0 From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942846594.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942844993.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942849797.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942850994.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942856038.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942859906.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873766.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942879656.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881679.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881832.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942877868.0 From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890104.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942886677.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890766.0 From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873625.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902019.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902876.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942903352.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904437.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904476.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942941898.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942943327.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? 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Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942979715.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943062417.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080441.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080489.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943129557.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943165471.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943206891.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943229522.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943307354.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943315260.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943350440.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943368324.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943367097.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943427990.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430192.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430386.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943457735.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943492644.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943499422.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943510835.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943511113.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > 943486989.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > 943487300.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich 943532818.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer 943545374.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ 943545481.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ 943545558.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943563499.0 From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943576406.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943533472.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943645917.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943729256.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943736031.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764345.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764578.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764780.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943765428.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943803375.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943819075.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943820630.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943884555.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943886835.0 From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943967584.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943970868.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943975037.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943973626.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943989371.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941462672.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941465823.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941452517.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941469374.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941471287.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941472367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473044.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473999.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474464.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474585.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474922.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941476481.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941477859.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941480317.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941491719.0 From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941499680.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941522905.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941523205.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941524250.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941554787.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941557367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941582605.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941583340.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941584316.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941590746.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941596443.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941558338.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606447.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606915.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941586635.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638397.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638716.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941639118.0 From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941653830.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941640261.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941641712.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941643053.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941644195.0 From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941647813.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941650678.0 From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941657735.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941667055.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941659760.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941719891.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941731328.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941734351.0 From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941754102.0 From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941757733.0 From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941761033.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941783582.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941758645.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941812725.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941810469.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941832235.0 From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941834028.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941838613.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824117.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824439.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898084.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898301.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898761.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941903168.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941910076.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941950718.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941951318.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941935394.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941989286.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941999562.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941976791.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942020429.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942024100.0 From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942033624.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942038189.0 From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942042060.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942018292.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075397.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942076263.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077608.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077867.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942079149.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942084703.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942086111.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942087147.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942088150.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942078790.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942094654.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942105737.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942112540.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942113605.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942114992.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121892.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075920.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942119268.0 From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942120748.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121172.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942155029.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942156048.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942160670.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942169558.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942175989.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. 942198419.0 From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942207215.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942211940.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942212787.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213084.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213126.0 From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233409.0 From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238694.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238939.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942239108.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233949.0 From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942281535.0 From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942284932.0 From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286620.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286277.0 From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942300692.0 From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942287768.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942297508.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942324808.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942347724.0 From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942345401.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942375043.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942376061.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942378769.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942381142.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942383894.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942384376.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942388935.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942389519.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942415271.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942455628.0 From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942438704.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942470270.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942459896.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942490469.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942510626.0 From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942495638.0 From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942513663.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942523028.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942526124.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942540987.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942585327.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942586705.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942590578.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604022.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942601044.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942602165.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942605547.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942609530.0 From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604589.0 From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942614659.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942622248.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942631821.0 From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942646845.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942678502.0 From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942702620.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942709566.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942714052.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942704109.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942716869.0 From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942718292.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942730598.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942721079.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942731420.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732046.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732164.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732405.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942738722.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942760532.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942762299.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942765299.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770385.0 From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770227.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942773600.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942775804.0 From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942790728.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942793942.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942795649.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942797486.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942798168.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942811188.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942799702.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809469.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809615.0 From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942846594.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942844993.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942849797.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942850994.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942856038.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942859906.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873766.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942879656.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881679.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881832.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942877868.0 From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890104.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942886677.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890766.0 From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873625.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902019.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902876.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942903352.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904437.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904476.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942941898.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942943327.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942979715.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943062417.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080441.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080489.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943129557.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943165471.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943206891.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943229522.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943307354.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943315260.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943350440.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943368324.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943367097.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943427990.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430192.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430386.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943457735.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943492644.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943499422.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943510835.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943511113.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > 943486989.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > 943487300.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich 943532818.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer 943545374.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ 943545481.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ 943545558.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943563499.0 From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943576406.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943533472.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943645917.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943729256.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943736031.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764345.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764578.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764780.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943765428.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943803375.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943819075.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943820630.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943884555.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943886835.0 From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943967584.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943970868.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943975037.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943973626.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943989371.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941462672.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941465823.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941452517.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941469374.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941471287.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941472367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473044.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473999.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474464.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474585.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474922.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941476481.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941477859.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941480317.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941491719.0 From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941499680.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941522905.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941523205.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941524250.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941554787.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941557367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941582605.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941583340.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941584316.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941590746.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941596443.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941558338.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606447.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606915.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941586635.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638397.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638716.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941639118.0 From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941653830.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941640261.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941641712.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941643053.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941644195.0 From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941647813.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941650678.0 From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941657735.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941667055.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941659760.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941719891.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941731328.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941734351.0 From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941754102.0 From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941757733.0 From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941761033.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941783582.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941758645.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941812725.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941810469.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941832235.0 From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941834028.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941838613.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824117.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824439.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898084.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898301.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898761.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941903168.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941910076.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941950718.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941951318.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941935394.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941989286.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941999562.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941976791.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942020429.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942024100.0 From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942033624.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942038189.0 From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942042060.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942018292.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075397.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942076263.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077608.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077867.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942079149.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942084703.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942086111.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942087147.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942088150.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942078790.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942094654.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942105737.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942112540.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942113605.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942114992.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121892.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075920.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942119268.0 From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942120748.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121172.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942155029.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942156048.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942160670.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942169558.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942175989.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. 942198419.0 From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942207215.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942211940.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942212787.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213084.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213126.0 From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233409.0 From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238694.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238939.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942239108.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233949.0 From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942281535.0 From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942284932.0 From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286620.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286277.0 From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942300692.0 From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942287768.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942297508.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942324808.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942347724.0 From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942345401.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942375043.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942376061.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942378769.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942381142.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942383894.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942384376.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942388935.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942389519.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942415271.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942455628.0 From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942438704.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942470270.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942459896.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942490469.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942510626.0 From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942495638.0 From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942513663.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942523028.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942526124.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942540987.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942585327.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942586705.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942590578.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604022.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942601044.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942602165.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942605547.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942609530.0 From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604589.0 From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942614659.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942622248.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942631821.0 From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942646845.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942678502.0 From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942702620.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942709566.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942714052.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942704109.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942716869.0 From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942718292.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942730598.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942721079.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942731420.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732046.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732164.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732405.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942738722.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942760532.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942762299.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942765299.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770385.0 From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770227.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942773600.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942775804.0 From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942790728.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942793942.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942795649.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942797486.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942798168.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942811188.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942799702.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809469.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809615.0 From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942846594.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942844993.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942849797.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942850994.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942856038.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942859906.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873766.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942879656.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881679.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881832.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942877868.0 From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890104.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942886677.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890766.0 From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873625.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902019.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902876.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942903352.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904437.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904476.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942941898.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942943327.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942979715.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943062417.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080441.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080489.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943129557.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943165471.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943206891.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943229522.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943307354.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943315260.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943350440.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943368324.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943367097.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943427990.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430192.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430386.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943457735.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943492644.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943499422.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943510835.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943511113.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > 943486989.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > 943487300.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich 943532818.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer 943545374.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ 943545481.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ 943545558.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943563499.0 From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943576406.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943533472.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943645917.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943729256.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943736031.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764345.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764578.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764780.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943765428.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943803375.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943819075.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943820630.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943884555.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943886835.0 From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943967584.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943970868.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943975037.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943973626.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943989371.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941462672.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941465823.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941452517.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941469374.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941471287.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941472367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473044.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473999.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474464.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474585.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474922.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941476481.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941477859.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941480317.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941491719.0 From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941499680.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941522905.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941523205.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941524250.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941554787.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941557367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941582605.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941583340.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941584316.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941590746.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941596443.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941558338.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606447.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606915.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941586635.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638397.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638716.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941639118.0 From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941653830.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941640261.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941641712.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941643053.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941644195.0 From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941647813.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941650678.0 From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941657735.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941667055.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941659760.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941719891.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941731328.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941734351.0 From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941754102.0 From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941757733.0 From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941761033.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941783582.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941758645.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941812725.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941810469.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941832235.0 From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941834028.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941838613.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824117.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824439.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898084.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898301.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898761.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941903168.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941910076.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941950718.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941951318.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941935394.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941989286.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941999562.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941976791.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942020429.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942024100.0 From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942033624.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942038189.0 From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942042060.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942018292.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075397.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942076263.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077608.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077867.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942079149.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942084703.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942086111.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942087147.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942088150.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942078790.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942094654.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942105737.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942112540.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942113605.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942114992.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121892.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075920.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942119268.0 From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942120748.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121172.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942155029.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942156048.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942160670.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942169558.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942175989.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. 942198419.0 From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942207215.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942211940.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942212787.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213084.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213126.0 From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233409.0 From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238694.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238939.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942239108.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233949.0 From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942281535.0 From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942284932.0 From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286620.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286277.0 From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942300692.0 From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942287768.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942297508.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942324808.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942347724.0 From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942345401.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942375043.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942376061.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942378769.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942381142.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942383894.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942384376.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942388935.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942389519.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942415271.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942455628.0 From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942438704.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942470270.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942459896.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942490469.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942510626.0 From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942495638.0 From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942513663.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942523028.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942526124.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942540987.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942585327.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942586705.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942590578.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604022.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942601044.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942602165.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942605547.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942609530.0 From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604589.0 From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942614659.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942622248.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942631821.0 From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942646845.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942678502.0 From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942702620.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942709566.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942714052.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942704109.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942716869.0 From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942718292.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942730598.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942721079.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942731420.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732046.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732164.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732405.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942738722.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942760532.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942762299.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942765299.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770385.0 From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770227.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942773600.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942775804.0 From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942790728.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942793942.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942795649.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942797486.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942798168.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942811188.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942799702.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809469.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809615.0 From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942846594.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942844993.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942849797.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942850994.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942856038.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942859906.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873766.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942879656.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881679.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881832.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942877868.0 From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890104.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942886677.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890766.0 From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873625.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902019.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902876.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942903352.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904437.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904476.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942941898.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942943327.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942979715.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943062417.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080441.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080489.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943129557.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943165471.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943206891.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943229522.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943307354.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943315260.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943350440.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943368324.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943367097.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943427990.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430192.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430386.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943457735.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943492644.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943499422.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943510835.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943511113.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > 943486989.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > 943487300.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich 943532818.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer 943545374.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ 943545481.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ 943545558.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943563499.0 From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943576406.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943533472.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943645917.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943729256.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943736031.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764345.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764578.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764780.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943765428.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943803375.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943819075.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943820630.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943884555.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943886835.0 From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943967584.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943970868.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943975037.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943973626.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943989371.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bzinser at nmu.edu Mon Nov 1 05:24:32 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:24:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 In-Reply-To: <381CE7BA.229C@ns.sympatico.ca> References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser I'm just wondering why nobody suggested inside storage. In these parts, cost about $1.50 a Sq. Foot. My boat has been stored inside since 1972 and the boat looks new. People can not believe the boat is 34 years old. Brian Zinser Manana #134 At 09:07 PM 10/31/1999 -0400, you wrote: >From: Matthew Wynn > >Thanks everybody for the response on winterizing cockpit/deck drains. > > You've convinced me to stick with a cover. Last winter was the first >one we owned Tazar #424 so having a lot of work to do we covered her for >the winter. I built a number of rafters out of 2"X3" and then placed >them on the deck and connected them with 1"x3" strapping. The rafters >hung over the rail far enough to allow air to circulate and keep the >tarp from beating on the toe rail and topsides. There was room enough to >stand up in the cockpit and crawl fore and aft on deck. I put fish >netting over the tarp to try and keep the tarp from self destructing >during those midwinter nor'easters. Everything was tied down to the >cradle/trailer with about a zillion feet of rope reminiscent of a spider >web. Needless to say it was a time consuming effort and plastic tarps >don't seem to be a great idea as by spring they were starting to leak a >little bit by spring and probably won't last another winter. > > A lot of boats do go uncovered for the winter around N.S. We had a >Tanzer 22 for 15 years and only covered the first year as the cover did >more damage beating the topsides then leaving it uncovered. After that >year we just shovled the snow every time it snowed. We also gave it a >good cleaning and waxing both fall and spring. However it was a less >complex boat than the A-30. > > Charles! - small world. I too was raised in New Glasgow. We moved > back >to the area about 8 years ago and live about 7 miles outside of town in >Woodburn which is situated on the Black Hall Gut at the west end of >Merigomish Harbour. The trip you describe sounds very similar to the one >Bill Tedesco - Ruah #421 is taking. I believe he started in Lake >Champlain, wintered over in Pictou last winter and is wintering over on >the Bras D'or lakes or Halifax this winter and then on to NYC the Hudson >etc. He was restricted to only 2 weeks this year and I tried to connect >with him in Pictou but apparently missed him by just hours. > > Matthew Wynn > Tazar #424 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941462672.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 06:17:03 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:17:03 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <941426109.11409@onelist.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per cruise). I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the furling jib. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941465823.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 1 02:35:17 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:35:17 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Roller Reefing handle References: <0.da1d8e76.254e7052@aol.com> Message-ID: <381D6CE5.AE7DA2FC@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White thanks, -Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941452517.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:00:38 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:00:38 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE References: <199911010257.VAA04843@min.net> Message-ID: <381DAB15.6C8E5D24@idirect.com> ATOMIC 4 FOR SALE The List: A member of my club, BSBC, has an Atomic 4 for sale, it is, I believe, a 1973 in good shape with transmission and all paraphernalia. He wants $1,800 Canadian or reasonable offer. I believe the exchange rate is about 1.47 or $ 1,225 US. The engine is in Kitchener Ontario, west of Toronto, and was in use until this haulout last week. It is a Lake Ontario, fresh water engine. Contact: Marc Campagna 1-519-496-2987 (cell) or 1-519-894-2987 John Birch, Sunstone KC-65 George Dinwiddie wrote: > From: George Dinwiddie > > John, > > Used bombs sell for a couple hundred to about $1500 dollars, depending > on condition of the engine and the seller. Rebuilt ones seem to go > for $2000 to $3000. These prices are all US dollars and off the top of > my head. I'm looking for a rebuildable, preferably fresh-water, engine > for a really reasonable price, under a thousand and preferably around > $500. I've had a couple deals fall through when someone else was quicker > or offered to help remove the engine. My day will come, though. In > the mean time, I've got a well-running, though rusty, engine. > > - George > > > John Birch said: > > > > What do used Atomic 4s sell for on average, what do rebuilt ones sell for > > also? > > -- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net > The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in > sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 1 07:16:14 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 10:16:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling References: Message-ID: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> From: John Birch Bob; "I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.)" It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. Caio, John Bob Johns wrote: > From: Bob Johns > > >From: ljsaund at tbaytel.net > > > >I would be interested in hearing any ideas to expedite the changeover from > >roller reefing to slab reefing on our Alberg30 (#395). > > This is to supplement the good advice given by Russ: > > When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point > at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the > first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced > the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a > second one above where the second one would normally be. (I don't remember > ever using the second one, and we used to average 900 to 1000 miles per > cruise). > > I never found a satisfactory tack hook , and so tied the tack down with a > short line. I found that I could pull in the reef without a tackle using > the halyard trick of pulling sideways on the line after taking all the > slack out of it. (There must be a name for that, but I don't know it.) > > Typically, on a beat, our speed would drop from 5.5 kts to 5 kts during the > reefing process and return to 5.5 kts with the reef in. This using the > furling jib. > > Regards, > Bob Johns, Wind Call, #387 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941469374.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 07:48:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:48:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I was interested to read your remarks: >When we bought Wind Call (#397) the mainsail had a single jiffy reef point >at the 1 1/2 reef position (ie: half way between the locations for the >first and second reefs). It proved so satisfactory that when we replaced >the sails we had the first reef installed in the same place and added a >second one above where the second one would normally be. I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations tracked my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second set -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did you hire to cut your sails? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941471287.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:06:07 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:06:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DBA6F.9BF88C7A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Bob, greetings. > > I was interested to read your remarks:... Here's another (unsolicited) opinion: I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often than the 1st. I've sailed the boat in up to 40 MPH winds with the 2nd reef and no jib, but even at 25-30 MPH, with the working jib and the 2nd reef it's very stable and easy to handle when double reefed. I think the incremental cost is very small compared to the benefit. The boat definitely gets over-powered at times, and it's nice to have the 1st reef -- go faster AND do less work. I have -never- regretted reefing... --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941472367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:17:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cooking Stoves Message-ID: <0.76524b0d.254f1714@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, By now you've all read my spiel and know I am a dyed in the wool Origo stove advocate, but just to contradict myself, there is a really cool looking double burner pressurised alcohol stove in EBay. Made in sweden, it could be 40 years old, from the look in the photos. Would look great in the cabin. But no, I'm not going to trade in the Origo. No pressurised cooking devices on Stargazer. regards, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473044.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 08:33:19 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:33:19 EST Subject: [alberg30] Reefing -- Give me 2 sets of reef points any day Message-ID: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Dan, greetings. thanks for your thoughts. You said: >I would *never* get a new main without 2 sets of reef points! Even in my >inland lake (Cayuga lake, Ithaca, NY), I have used both sets of reef >points any number of times over 14 years, and the second set more often >than the 1st. Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all conditions? Bob's point, if I understand him, is that the deeper first reef works for him in nearly all conditions; he says he has a second reef, but has never used it. You are right, that the incremental cost of a second set of reef points is low. But do you think that it is a bad idea to locate the first set higher on the sail, as Bob suggests? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941473999.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 08:41:04 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:41:04 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <381DAEBC.70D2B019@idirect.com> References: Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >It is called "sweating" a line or halyard. > John, Thanks. (I knew that once.) Regards, Bob --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474464.0 From dans at stmktg.com Mon Nov 1 08:43:05 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 11:43:05 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Give me 2 sets of reef points any day References: <0.798a3c81.254f1acf@aol.com> Message-ID: <381DC319.C373E512@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > Dan, greetings. >... > Fair enough -- I don't think that I would want only a single set, either, if > the set were placed at the first reef point of most sails. But do you see > any merit in Bob's comment, that a single set of reef points midway between > the two traditional reef placements gives him a reef that works in nearly all > conditions? If I could only have one set, it would pretty close to the second set of reef points, since I use them more often and -still- have (on rare occasions) also dropped the jib. I guess it boils down to how easily you can reef. If you put the appropriate blocks and cleats on the boom, and leave the reefing lines in place, you can reef quickly and easily once you get into the habbit. If, OTOH, you don't expect to reef often, or don't want to deal with leaving the reefing lines rigged, one is probably better. In either case, if you suspect that you might need to reef underway, you should be prepared to reef quickly, which most likely means leaving it rigged, and having a plan to hook the outhaul to the reef point on the leech, or get enough tension in the foot of the sail from the reeflin line (unlikely, in my experience). --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474585.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 1 08:48:42 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:48:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021955A4@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Sanders, Its not the idea of leaving when a second reef is required, it is getting back! That is, in two years of sailing Calliope on the Chesapeake and Delaware Bays, I've probably used the second reef 10% of the time that I needed the first reef. After putting in the second reef, if she feels undercanvased, I can always fine tune the sail area with the roller furling genoa, and it helps to tune the balance as well. But when all hell breaks loose, I'm very happy I have that second reef- it means I still can sail my boat and keep her underway safely and comfortably. I admit, if I was having a new main made I'd even go for a third reef... Tom F. Calliope #287 > I am about to spring for a new suit of sails, and your observations > tracked > my thoughts about going with only a single set of reef points. I cannot > imagine there being enough wind in the Sound that would require a second > set > -- at least, not in conditions that I would be likely to leave port. My > question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the > deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels > undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did > > you hire to cut your sails? > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941474922.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 09:14:41 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 12:14:41 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.1e437a4d.254f2481@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Russ, Found the hard way that if the leach reefing line is made fast to a cleat on the mast, rather than on the boom, the tension in the line changes as the boom swings: tightens as the boom swings away from the cleat, loosens as it swings towards the cleat. Reeks havoc on the foot tension and subsequent sail shape. Best to have the cleat on the stbd. side of the boom, which is the side the main halyard is on the mast, and as far forward as you can attach it. Best to tap a thread into the boom and use bolts, vs. trying to get away with self tapping sheet metal screws. If you want the lines to lead aft to the cockpit, attach the turning blocks to the for end of the boom, for the same reason. As far as the attachment of leach lines, there are several ways to do this; set main on boom, and attachthe reef's luff cringle to tack hook, then pull the foot of the reef back tight, to see where the leach cringle falls on the boom. A) fasten a cheek block on an 18" track on the stbd side of the boom. The leach line will then dead end on a post on the cheek block, run under the boom, then through the reef cringle,then back to the sheave, then forward to the cleat through one or two fairleads. B)attach a track to the port side of the boom, with a simple genny car on it. Attach a block at the aft end of the boom. reefing line then dead ends on car, runs up through cringle,aft to block, then forward to cleat through fairleads. C) measure position of leach cringle very carefully, then mount padeye on port side of boom 12" aft. Run leach line as for B. D) use rolling hitch with at least 3 extra turns in place of pad eye. B is my choice. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941476481.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 09:37:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:37:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.c0ebc7f.254f1037@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >My >question: Have you found, on those times that you have reefed using the >deeper first reef, that there is a range in which your boat feels >undercanvassed when reefed, but overcanvassed when not? And what loft did >you hire to cut your sails? Sanders, No, that deep first reef location seems just right, at least for the way we sail. In my example (5.5, 5, 5.5, kts), we reefed because the wind was gradually rising and we were heeling enough to be a little uncomfortable. As you can see we made the same speed with the reef in as we did before reefing. The day before that happened we had overnighted in Boothbay Harbor when dozens of Friendship sloops had a regatta there. Four or five left before we did, going our way. One was behind the others and we passed him as he took his first reef. The Friendship sloops use the old "tie in the reef points" system and we were interested to compare it to the jiffy system. We saw that he went almost dead in the water as he tied in the reef points, and it took him a long time. At the time he was reefing, we had no need to reef. A little later we caught the other Friendship sloops and passed them as they were tying in their second reef. Again, they went almost dead in the water and it was then that we decided to reef our sail. We checked the speed before, during and after the reefing to compare the two reefing systems. The numbers stuck in my mind because we lost practically no distance during the reefing (the 1/2 knot decrease for maybe two minutes.) I didn't mean that you should not get the second reef point. Our next set of sails will still have one. (Thinking back on it, I realize that we did use it once or twice - but not very much.) The sails are 17 years old and I expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I am out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if anything needs fixing. Regards, Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Choose from a wide selection of high-quality newsletters at ONElist. For details on ONElist's PROS&PUNDITS newsletters, click below. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941477859.0 From SandersM at aol.com Mon Nov 1 10:18:37 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 13:18:37 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Bob, greetings. I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we should have by email. (Do you Bay denizen mind the chat about the Sound?) But in reply to your message: >The sails are 17 years old and I >expect to replace them this year. The first replacement set came from >Ulmer/Kolius at City Island. They were good sails. I will probably check >out a local sailmaker first but am not sure where I will go for them. I >am >out of touch with subject. (Just looked in the yellow pages and the >sailmaker that has done repairs for me isn't even listed!) I'd be >interested to hear what you find out. I had thought that I might try an >Annapolis sailmaker, but I am a little leery about being too far away if >anything needs fixing. Mine are only a bit newer, from the Hild loft on City Island. I talked to the UK folks on City Island over the summer and thought that their estimate was high. I've also spoken with the Triton loft in Ontario (the folks who cut the original A30 sails) and was quoted a rate of CDN$2565 for a fully-battened main and CDN$2345 for a 153% roller-furling genoa with a foam luff insert. By my calculations, this works out to something around $3,500, which is a bit less less than UK. I've just returned from a four-day sail up to Stonington (INCREDIBLE weather!) to leave WILD ELF with Dodson's Boatyard for the winter. Their service manager tells me that Dodson's recommends a couple of local lofts in Mystic that will cut the sails for a good deal less than the Triton quote. If you want, I will send you their quotes when I receive them. Another option that occurred to me, but that I haven't pursued, is the Banks loft in Oyster Bay. I have heard good things about their work from the folks at Oyster Bay Marine Center. The advantage of using them, for us, would be that thery are local and can fit the sails to our rigs with little travel. My boat, though, is now in the Eastern Sound for the winter, so I'm not sure it makes sense for me to ask them to cut the sails. Do you suppose that we should look into the possibility of buying the sails together, as a single purchase? Would a loft offer a discount if it were cutting two suits at the same time? If you're interested, I will ask the Mystic lofts when I speak with them whether they would give a discount for two suits. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941480317.0 From bobjns at nais.com Mon Nov 1 13:28:39 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:28:39 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.33a7e047.254f337d@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns >From: SandersM at aol.com > >Bob, greetings. > >I'm never sure whether these exchanges about Long Island Sound are >appropriate for general list discussion, or whether this is a dialogue we >should have by email. Let's take it off the list. But any advice from the list on buying sails is welcome! Bob Johns, Wind Call, #397 bobjns at nais.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941491719.0 From cjk at tir.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:20 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 1999 18:41:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Winterizing A-30 References: <000001bf220b$a8a16f80$c383e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> <4.2.0.58.19991101082205.00aef940@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Brian; >From your e-mail address I summarize that you are in the Michigan UP. Storage costs in the lower peninsula are considerably higher (both inside and out) and I suspect they get progressively higher the further south you go. For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941499680.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:08:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:08:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.6c533d12.254fd9d9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com That trick of puling the line sideways, and quickly taking up the slack, is called 'sweating" up the halyard. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941522905.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:13:25 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:13:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.4689fcd6.254fdb05@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Saunders, It's not that you would leve port in such conditions, it's the getting caught out in such conditions that call the second reef.. I've only used mine about 3 times in 12 years, but I was sure glad I had it then. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941523205.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 1 22:30:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 01:30:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.238e93b3.254fdf1a@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Get EXPERT CONTENT at ONElist! Join PROS&PUNDITS. For details go to: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941524250.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 1 15:28:33 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 04:30:10 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:30:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000201bf252e$01ff5fe0$6e83e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Guy: My cradle has a foot print of 5'X8' with four pads. You are right Albergs sit on the keel so the pads are for stability only. Your 8 pad cradle may have been designed for transportation purposes. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 1, 1999 6:29 PM To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 2 06:01:31 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:01:31 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> Guy; How ya doin'? The only advantage to having 6 or 8 pads is in the Spring when you can lower half, staggered, and paint under them. This advantage is not to be underestimated as the paint has an opportunity to cure properly and saves time on the crane or travel lift. On a new cradle I would go with a minimum of 6 plus the forefoot, all adjustable, or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x 6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. You are right, the load should be 100% on the keel and not the pads, well maybe there is some load on the forefoot but nowhere else. John Guy Lalonde wrote: > Will eventually need to replace my A-30 cradle, it's starting to shows > its age. I looks like the 4 inner pads once folded but a previous > owner had the folding parts welded. Mine has 8 pads. Was this standard > A-30 issue ? Does anyone out there have only 6 or 4 ? Is there a good > reason for needing 8 pads ? Because my understanding is that the > weight of the boat rests on the keel and the pads are only meant to > prevent the boat from falling to the side. Cheers,Guy.Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 2 06:59:47 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 09:59:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles In-Reply-To: <381EEEBA.E8D810C6@idirect.com> References: <001401bf24c0$d060d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991102093131.01ea2100@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:01 AM 11/2/99 -0500, John Birch wrote: >[...] or if you want to save money and always use a crane, go with jack >stands, 7 minimum including the forefoot and put the keel on 4 x 8s or 4 x >6s oriented athwart the keel. Chain the stands together and voil?. My marina uses only 4 plus a forefoot without any problem, even with the occasional hurricane that passes over Annapolis. And they routinely will reset one (at a time) to paint under. We do have a nice solid concrete base, though. I'm not sure of the criteria they use to decide when to use more stands on larger boats. Alberg 30's are comfortable with 2 pair. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941554787.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Tue Nov 2 07:42:47 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:42:47 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Indoor Storage In-Reply-To: <000801bf24c2$9ad57900$9c8b28d8@default> Message-ID: <000601bf2548$e94ca2d0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> From: "Bob Lincoln" At Gimli there is an old Commonwealth Air Training base with 8 or so wooden hangers from WWII. Some have been upgraded and used for winter storage of planes, automobiles, boats and RV's. Although prices rise each year, I just paid my rental for 1999-2000. The total yearly cost for #590 is $920 Cdn or about $614 US. It's heated to about 50 degrees and there's lots of light, outlets, cold water and a john. Bob Lincoln #590 ...For instance at Brennan's Marine in Bay City (four draw bridges and 5 miles up the Saginaw River from Saginaw Bay) outside storage is $1.50 Sq. Ft.; inside storage (unheated) is $3.00 Sq. Ft. and heated inside storage is $5.00 Sq. Ft. At these rates the approx. outside storage for an A-30 is $400 outside vs. approx. $1300 for heated inside. Ego outside storage for most of use. Chet Koop Tangaroa 445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941557367.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 14:43:25 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:43:25 EST Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling Message-ID: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Stargazer came with an old main........looked very old!!!! It had no reef points whatsoever, as was torn across from luff to leach 1/3 down from the head of the sail. Even above the tear, the dacron was so worn that there were moth-like holes in the panels, from UV expolsure, and chaffe, I'm sure. Sails to me are holy things, so even though I knew I'd replace this old main, I still repaired it, to keep as a spare. At the 98 Atlantic City Sail on ly show, I went to every sailmaker and got a qoute on a main with two reef point rows. The expensive lofts offered sale 'Boat Show Prices" that were over two grand, from Shore, etc. North had two qoutes-the over 2 grand price, and their economy price, about 1500.00, from their Eastern lofts. These are in the far east, and I don't mean Montauk. Ditto for Quantum. Lee sails, made in Hong Kong, gave me a qoute of a sail delivered, for about 900.00. I had no plans to race Stargazer, and I only wanted a strong cruising main, with a reasonable sail shape, so I went with Lee sails. The sail looks good, stretched out on the lawn-very nice workmanship on the 'corners' and reef lines, leach and luff liines, tell tales sewed into the leach, batten pockets are strongly sewed, etc. Can't report on shape yet, as I didn't get a chance to use it yet!! The only problem is that the reefs lines are too low, and too close together- I didn't think it would be necessary to specify exactly where I wanted the two reefs put in- when ordering a cruising main with two reefs, I thought the placement of them was fairly standard-I guess not!!! But aside from that, the main looks good, and was hundreds less than other quoted mains. The importer is named Cal, and he is in Patchogue, on LI. You can get his phone # from the yellow pages, to call him for a quote. He, and his wife are very nice. If you do speak to him, say hi to him for me!! If you're buying a whole set of sails, you will probably get a 'free' headsail, relatively speaking, by going with Lee. My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the difference if you are racing. I can email Gary Schmitt and get the name of the loft if you are interested. Back in 1990, I got a whole set of sails for my Alberg 22 from the City Island U/K loft. it was a beautiful set of sails, and at a great boat show price that was offered that year, was worth every penny. We took good care of them, and when we sold the boat in 98, they all still looked new, and had great shape. and it was always fun to drive to City Island to pick them up!! That would be my advice-go to the boat shows this winter, and get the best boat show special you can, and buy alot of sails!!!! Are they having the Atlantic City Sail only show this year? if so , that's the place to buy sails for next season. I love buying sails!! Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer, #255 with a brand new Lee main in a bag in the attic!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941582605.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 2 14:55:40 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:55:40 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Sails & boat shows References: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <381F6BEC.FEECF6B9@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Sanders, and Bob, and friends, Lee and others, I also usually go to the Atlantic city boat show. I wonder how many on this list are going? Maybe we could meet for lunch... --Dan S. dans at stmktg.com Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941583340.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 15:11:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:11:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] 2 cents more on: slab reefing Message-ID: <0.38ddadcc.2550c9bc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/2/99 1:31:19 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << Lee, I found two nice hooks, with good sized eyes, I bought a long bolt, and I bolt them where the tack of the main fits on the forward part of the boom. It takes a few minutes to rig in the spring, but after it's tightened, iit's there in the proper position. Use a nylock nut I use some big stainles washers. Heres the drill, take, the bolt, put on a washer, put on the hook, insert bolt through the hole, through the clew of the sail, and out the other side, Put on the other hook, washer, and tighten the nut. We run the 1st reef on the starboard hook, the 2nd on the port one.. 1st and 2nd reef blocks and lines are on port side of boom with a small # 6 winch mounted forward. Sure helps when its blowing Russ. >> Hi Russ, Sounds like a good system!! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941584316.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Tue Nov 2 16:59:06 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:59:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: slab reefing and headsail furling In-Reply-To: <0.d6fa323d.2550c30d@aol.com> Message-ID: <199911030059.TAA25027@min.net> From: "George Dinwiddie" I recommend the full top batten, even if you're not increasing the roach. (In fact, our sail was built as a racing sail and has that same annoying tendency to hang on the backstay. I'm thinking of getting it trimmed down.) I also recommend the second reef. We had that added last year after a day in November when I'd wished I already had a second reef. The boat did fine, but I sailed on just the back third of the main to keep her on her feet. The gust that hit when I came out from under the Bay Bridge put the portlight in the water. - George > My freinds on Sea Gal, #248, went with a fairly new NJ loft for their new > main. I think they spent about 1500.00, and it is a beautiful sail, with a > full length batten up on top, that spreads the additional roach. The damn > thing hits the backstay with every tack or jibe, but I guess in light air, it > gives you that added few square inches of sail area aloft that could make the > difference if you are racing. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941590746.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Tue Nov 2 18:34:03 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 21:34:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. Charles Haggart # 150 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941596443.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 07:58:58 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 10:58:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <003401bf254b$2c9cc630$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, check out Dickinson diesel heaters as well as Espar. A previous owner installed a Dickinson on my boat. I have yet to use it so I can't comment on them. However I believe they are not cheap. A similar Dickinson model in West Marine goes for $600 US then you need a fuel transfer pump if not gravity fed which is another $110 US. An inexpensive alternative is an Origo heater. They go for about $150 CDN, run on alcohol, no pressure, inside it actually uses the same canister as used in their stoves, provides 5000 BTU. You don't need to hook it up to your diesel tank, don't need a fuel pump and don't have to install a chimney. You can even use it to cook yourself something. A buddy of mine has one and he loves it. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941558338.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:20:47 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:20:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A-30 Cradles Message-ID: <0.4a7ed143.2551202f@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I'm useing a Catalina 30 cradle. I bought it used for $300. A guy sold his boat, and the new owner sailed it away to the other side of the state. My yard cut the cross braces, front, and rear, and they have a long wooden 6x6, or so, under the keel. This is with the original bolts in the adjustable side pieces. I could lower them, drill and fit new bolts.....but that's just another project. It works. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606447.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 2 21:28:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 00:28:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941606915.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Tue Nov 2 15:50:35 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:50:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941586635.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:13:17 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:13:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Russ; There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed over with a Plexiglas blank. The story goes that one of the previous owners (not the guy I bought her from) got so cold one night he burned the main cabin louvered teak door to stay warm. The door was replaced with one made from wall panelling. I removed it last summer. A new door is also on the list of rebuilds. -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com [mailto:Rap1208 at aol.com] Sent: November 3, 1999 12:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Rap1208 at aol.com Charles, just curious, where would you install a force 10 unit? Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638397.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 3 06:18:36 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:18:36 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000e01bf258d$0e8e5a90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000101bf2606$51afd3c0$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> From: "Charles Haggart" Guy; Thanks for the sites. I forgot that you have one. Anytime now would be a good time to is if it puts out the BTUs you need. -----Original Message----- From: Guy Lalonde [mailto:lalondegc at videotron.ca] Sent: November 2, 1999 6:51 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater From: Guy Lalonde Charles, here are the URLs for Dickinson's & Espar's line of products. Mine was installed on the aft side of the aft bulkhead (on the outer wall of the hanging locker). http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/Default.htm http://www.espar.com/ Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Charles Haggart To: Alberg Alberg 30 (E-mail) Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:34 PM Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: "Charles Haggart" > > I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the > winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as > well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the > hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > > Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941638716.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 3 06:25:18 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:25:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000201bf25a3$e56d3660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Charles, I have a Taylor Kerosene heater that is mounted on the bulkhead with the fuel tank in the locker. Very classic looking (brass) and with its central location, heats and drys the whole cabin. We use it often up in these parts. It is vented through the cabin top by a small stove pipe. You might be able to find one at used store or perhaps somebody on this list has one sitting in a basement. Brian Zinser #134 At 09:34 PM 11/02/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: "Charles Haggart" > >I'm looking for a cabin heater for the boat. I want to install it over the >winter. I have looked at force 10s but I am interested in other makes as >well. I think I want a diesel one. I open the floor for discussion in the >hope that there may be a used one floating around out there in Alberg land. > >Charles Haggart # 150 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941639118.0 From mgoettle at erols.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:30 1999 From: mgoettle at erols.com (Marjorie Goettle) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:30 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <4.2.0.58.19991103092102.00ae6860@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <38207F46.30D4@erols.com> From: Marjorie Goettle We have used a Force 10 diesel for about 10 years. It works well, although so high on the bulkhead (stbd. backing on the hanging locker) it is hard to have warm feet. If you go the Force 10 route, we strongly advise you to use kerocene. It will burn cleaner. The Force 10 people suggest this, as well as others we have met that have them. Force 10 makes a good product and have given us good service (burners go after a few years -- no other trouble. We put the tank inside the hanging locker. -- Marjorie & Bill Goettle and the cat crew of the new SV Jubilant(s) - Allied Princess ketch #108 (& #435 Alberg 30) http://www.erols.com/mgoettle/ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941653830.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 3 06:44:21 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:44:21 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <000001bf2605$944b0660$c583e2d1@black-point.bellglobal.com> References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >From: "Charles Haggart" > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed >over with a Plexiglas blank. When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941640261.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:08:32 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:08:32 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater-Bag of Coal, plus much more Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D83E9@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Bob, I have one of the Raelco "Kole Stoves" mounted on the port bulkhead, it came with the boat. I routinely use charcoal brickettes, which of course you can buy in a bag. I've had no luck trying to buy coal, but my Alexandria friends suggest that if I go walk the railroad tracks leading up to the powerplant on the northside of the city on the river, I'll find all I want on the ground-just have to pick it up bit by bit. Anyway, the solid fuel stove works great, with a bulkhead fan to move the air around there is little stratification, it definately is a season extender for cruising when the days are tolerable but the nights would otherwise drive you into a sleeping bag at dusk. For the record, I had a Taylor kerosene heater on a prior boat, with a primus type burner. It kept the boat warm, but you definately need an auxiliary tank, and I don't like the fickleness of the burners-always needing cleaning, tinkering. I'd never go that route again. For a really great installation if diesel is already onboard, I'd consider the smallest Espar forced air diesel furnace-those will give you use of the boat year round, or at least until the ice in the water restricts your travel. Expensive, though. Finally, if an Alberger is thinking about a heater, and already has propane on board, I'd strongly recommend looking at a British product, the P4 by Carver. For $700 you get a 5000 btu forced air furnace that is smaller than a loaf of bread, very safe, quiet, and uses just a smidgen of propane and electricity. I have one installed in my VW Camper, and it is just fantastic. While marketed here for campers, the manufacturer also sells the same units for boats in the UK. Check it out at http://www.eurocampers.com/Carver.html > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:44 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: Robert Kirk > > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been > sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941641712.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 07:30:53 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:30:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin Heaters Message-ID: <3820552C.9820A324@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Just a comment about the placement of chimneys for cabin heaters. My boat came with a force 10 kerosene cabin heater. It works well enough when at anchor. However the few times I have used it at dock I've had problems with the draw on the chimney as a result the cabin would back up with fumes. I think this is caused by the chimney being vented through the cabin top on the lower step portion. I believe the chimney needs to extend above the higher portion of the cabin. I'm not sure as I have not done anything about the problem. When I'm at the dock I plug in and use an electric heater. I have never used the heater when I'm sailing. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941643053.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 3 07:31:53 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 10:31:53 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.c3d59d65.25512203@aol.com> <4.2.0.58.19991103093505.01e708c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Bob; Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption the garage for the mice. On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is expensive). Caio, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Wed Nov 3 07:49:55 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 10:49:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB021D850A@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Well, now I am glad I never tried to actually use coal! My stovepipe takes a bit on an angle from the port bulkhead and does go through the high part of the cabin top. Thankfully, though I use it a lot I've never had to clean up a mess on deck. > -----Original Message----- > From: John Birch [SMTP:sunstone at idirect.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 10:32 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > Bob; > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous > owner swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite > with charcoal briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but > usually you need a blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out > and I have seen chimneys start to glow red - not a good thing, though a > dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the > briquettes, the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, > put the contraption the garage for the mice. > > On a serious note, remember to leave a port or hatch open enough to draw > in fresh air as people have asphyxiated in closed cabins with stoves that > lack their own outside air source (Sigmar has one but the unit is > expensive). > > Caio, > > John > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > From: Robert Kirk > > >From: "Charles Haggart" > > > >There was a wood stove/heater in the boat years ago and it was > mounted to > >starboard on the hanging locker bulkhead. The flue vent hole has > been sealed > >over with a Plexiglas blank. > > When I bought Isobar, it came with what sounds like that same > pot-bellied > stove/heater together with the necessary flues and insulation > amongst its > supplies. The cabin top has a blank which could easily replaced by > Charlie > Noble. The rig sits in my garage never used. I never installed it > since > I'm a fair weather sailor (getting time to haul now), and frostbite > and I > don't get along. But I'm wondering if anyone has used one > successfully. > It seems like it and a bag of coal might be just the thing to extend > the > season a little. (Can one still buy a bag of coal?) > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free > Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama > FREE! > Click > Here > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941644195.0 From SandersM at aol.com Wed Nov 3 08:50:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:50:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove Message-ID: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941647813.0 From john at cep.ca Wed Nov 3 09:37:58 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 12:37:58 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater Message-ID: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> A ceramic heater is a good idea I use a 120 volt ceramic heater and it works great and is compact. However running one on 12 volts is another matter. 10 amps for 8 hours is 80 amp hours. Given that it is not wise to discharge a battery more than fifty per cent. That would mean a battery with a 160 amp hour rating. That is a very big battery. If the heater was used on a regular bases the life of the battery would be compromised particularly if it was also being used for other things. (running lights, anchor light,ect) Summer Salt 447 -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941650678.0 From dans at stmktg.com Wed Nov 3 11:35:35 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:35:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater - Kole Stove References: <0.913516e6.2551c1c5@aol.com> Message-ID: <38208E87.20860551@stmktg.com> SandersM at aol.com wrote: > > From: SandersM at aol.com > > I was going to pass up this thread except for the fact that I just finished a > four-day run up the Sound to Stonington with beautiful days and FRIGID > nights, so suddenly this talk about cabin heaters has captured my attention. > > A quick look inside the BOAT/US catalogue reveals only electric heaters. One > -- a PTC ceramic heater, $24.95 -- runs on 12v DC and draws 10 amps. Not > being electric-literate, I wonder whether one could run this off of a single > battery for 6-8 hours at a time, and get enough warmth from it to take the > edge off of late October nights. Thoughts? In a word no. A typical deep cycle battery is about 60 amp-hours capacity, and you won't get even the full capacity at such a rapid (10 amp) discharge rate. I think an electrical heater is ipractical, especially since you don't want to run the engine all the time to charge the battery or provide the power to the heater. --Dan Sternglass dans at stmktg.com --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Was the salesman clueless? Productopia has the answers. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941657735.0 From gdinwiddie at mail.min.net Wed Nov 3 14:10:55 1999 From: gdinwiddie at mail.min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 1999 17:10:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater In-Reply-To: <38205564.C4E36B10@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> We've got a Dickinson Newport solid fuel stove. http://www.dickinsonmarine.com/images/newpor2.jpg I've used anthracite, bituminous, charcoal and wood in it. Don't use self-lighting charcoal briquettes. They make a lot of soot. The plain ones aren't bad, but old-fashioned lump charcoal works better. Any fuel will require tending or it will go out, but coal keeps going longer than others. - George > Sunstone came with a Cole Stove and some anthracite which the previous owner > swore by and I swear at. First you have to start the anthracite with charcoal > briquettes, if your lucky the anthracite will get going but usually you need a > blow torch. It is hard to control the heat coming out and I have seen chimneys > start to glow red - not a good thing, though a dry heat to be sure. > > In the morning you are greeted on deck with soot and mess from the briquettes, > the solution - go to a liquid stove and do as you have done, put the contraption > the garage for the mice. ------------------------------------------------- The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span, those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941667055.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 3 12:09:20 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 20:09:20 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] PTC ceramic heater References: <382072F6.6E0F28A4@cep.ca> Message-ID: <38209670.987CBE28@crosslink.net> We used to take a big clay flower pot and invert it over the alcohol stove. Works pretty well but I would not go to sleep with it going. It it's too cold to survive in the cabin in a sleeping bag (preferably with someone in there with you of the opposite sex) I think it's too cold to sail. I recall one Chesapeake Appreciation Days about this time of year or later, when it was pretty chilly but after turning off the stove our body heat kept the cabin from getting all that cold. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941659760.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Thu Nov 4 04:51:31 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 08:51:31 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <199911032211.RAA11835@min.net> Message-ID: <3821814E.98624AF6@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg There seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Accurate impartial advice on everything from laptops to table saws. Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941719891.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:02:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:02:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heaters Message-ID: <0.738759b4.25530800@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, I'm reading this thread on cabin heaters with great interest, because it is one more project we have to tackle on Stargazer. She came with the charlie noble in place, but no stove- only the charred outline on the port forward bulkhead, 2/3 of the way up, where the stove had been. the cabin overhead was marked wth a fine layer of soot. Rona and I have looked at the Newport solid fuel stove, and read about the the Force 10, kerosene, diesel, etc. etc. We both love watching a fire in a fireplace, so the solid fuel is attractive to us, but tending a fire in a 4"by4" fireplace might not be worth it, considering the effieciency of the kerosene that we would be giving up. Also in the back of my mind are the descriptions of the old Shipmate coal stoves that Wm. Atkin often included in his articles about his old wooden double ended designs, glowingly talking about the warmth of the cabin from their dry fires. But too, I recall Rockwell Kent cursing the same shipmates stoves in 'N by E', as that 33 foot modified Colin Archer 'Direction' rolled and pitched on her way to Greenland in 1929, spewing smoke and ashes all over him. "What twisted mind thought of a coal range at sea....." he exclaimed. Academic, anyway, because where would I put a Shipmate coal range on an Alberg 30. My experimentation with coal will have to wait until I can build my Atkin double ender!! For those of you familiar with Wm. Atkin's designs, the one I love is Thistle, the 32 ft. flush deck cutter. Very similar in hull shape, if not identical, to Suhaili, The boat Robin Knox-Johnston sailed around the world in 1968. So, yes, this is a letter with no conclusion. Is it only early November? :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941731328.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:52:31 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 11:52:31 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a cabin that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan can get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. My 2 cents- Greg >> You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often etc. etc. Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941734351.0 From dans at stmktg.com Thu Nov 4 14:21:42 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:21:42 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bulhead space (was re:Cabin heater) References: <0.67bb465f.255313cf@aol.com> Message-ID: <382206F6.9488A7B2@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, your > solution is very, very practical... I've had my (charcoal burining, wood-stove-like, gotta-be-permanent) stove on the stbd bulkhead for all 14-years I've had this boat. Since it is mounted high enough that you can still stretch out completely on the berth, it has not been a problem. When I proposed mounting something else below it, my wife objected violently to the loss of leg-room. Seaprately, I got no responses to "Atlantic City boat show." Is it really true that none of the A-30 list people are plannng to go? --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, #211, 1966, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941754102.0 From RLeach at mbayaq.org Thu Nov 4 15:22:13 1999 From: RLeach at mbayaq.org (Rick Leach) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 15:22:13 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: From: Rick Leach The only real problem with the Origo is that it's not dry heat. Am I wrong or isn't water vapor one of the major products of combustion. The bulkhead heater is vented outside the boat, and the vapor is not trapped inside the boat. I would imagine that rather than helping alleviating condensation that it would increase it. Any thoughts? Rick Leach Sugar Magnolia, #121 > ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com[SMTP:FINNUS505 at aol.com] > Reply To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:52 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't > see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake > Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can > be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... > Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee > hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As > tempting > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be > for > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941757733.0 From SandersM at aol.com Thu Nov 4 16:17:13 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 19:17:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the stove canisters. Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941761033.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Thu Nov 4 22:33:02 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 01:33:02 EST Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater Message-ID: <0.e4a5d190.2553d41e@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com For space saving as well as efficiency and saftey, I think the best solution would be an Espar forced hot air diesel heater under the cockpit sole or in one or the sail lockers. I believe they vent in much the same way as the engine and they would be near the diesel feul tank. Anyway, I know they're meant to be mounted belowdecks. Then a single 4" flexible duct under the sink and starboard bunk, thru the hanging locker and into the forward cabin would keep everything toasty warm and dry. But we're talking minimum 3+ grand here without installation. I guess the expense is not worth the benefits for those of us on the Chesapeake (not enough cold months) but for NJ and north, it's something to think about. Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/4/99 5:16:10 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, > fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net writes: > > << here seams to be a lot of talk about "permanently mounted" heaters in a > cabin > that gets very small with 2 or 3 people below decks. Frankly... I can't see > how you can afford to loose that bulkhead space with one of these "great > looking space consuming" devices. The sailing season hear on Lake Michigan > can > get a little chilly near the end of the season and a heating device can be > well worth the investment. Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, > portable, 5000 btu for about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > When it not in use... it goes in the lazarette. > > My 2 cents- Greg >> > > You know what Greg, that makes realy good sense on a 30 footer. As tempting > > as it is to have the stove mounted on the bulkhead for asthetic reasons, > your > solution is very, very practical. Then the port forward bulkhead can be for > > a bookcase, clock, barometer and kerosene lamp, which are used more often > etc. etc. > Thx, > Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941783582.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 4 15:37:25 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf271d$8ca7b840$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Sanders, I don't know about parts, but the whole unit costs $120 US as per the West Marine catalogue. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:17 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Cabin heater > From: SandersM at aol.com > > > In a message dated 11/4/99 8:45:31 AM, fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net > writes: > > >Our solution was the Heat Pal by Origo... Safe, portable, 5000 btu for > >about 8 hour period and it can keep your coffee hot. > > Sounds good to me. Where can you get one, and for how much? I remember > someone else here saying that they are powered by the same canisters that > fuel the stoves. Since I already have an Origo stove -- and, in my humble > opinion, they ROCK! -- I'm wondering if I can just buy the other part(s) > separately, or if I can contrive something on my own to work with one of the > stove canisters. > > Sanders McNew > WILD ELF (# 297) > Oyster Bay, New York > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941758645.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Fri Nov 5 06:38:45 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 5 Nov 1999 14:38:45 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941812725.8120@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941812725.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Fri Nov 5 06:01:09 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 10:01:09 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Cabin heater References: <0.609164fd.25537c09@aol.com> Message-ID: <3822E324.A92759C5@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg Where can you get one, and for how much? Sanders... I see them in your typical marine cataloges for around $120.00 complete. They run approx. 8 hrs on a pint of alcohol. Kindest regards- Greg --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941810469.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 5 12:03:55 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:03:55 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941832235.0 From JRogers at scelectric.ca Fri Nov 5 12:33:48 1999 From: JRogers at scelectric.ca (Jim Rogers) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 15:33:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> From: Jim Rogers Gavin, I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could send some information. Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 -----Original Message----- From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM To: Alberg30 Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions From: Gavin Jefferies Hi, Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine maintenance book. The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which in my case means a trip to a professional. Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. Thanks, Gavin --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941834028.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Fri Nov 5 13:50:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:50:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <9018B5BE3241D311872C00C04F52A8E7045064@CLIFF> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Gavin, I would first change your fuel filter and then if the problem still persists change your points. It sounds to me like you have pitted contacts on your points. About $10 dollars for a new set of points and an hour of your time should correct the problem. While not necessary, I would also change the condenser at the same time. If you need parts for your Greymarine, there is a boatyard in Cedarville Michigan which has just about everything you would ever need. The manual Jim describes below has information on just about everything you really need to know. Brian Zinser #134 At 03:33 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Jim Rogers > >Gavin, > >I have an original Greymarine engine manual for my 1965 Alberg 30. If you >contact me by E-mail with your address or possibly a fax number, I could >send some information. > >Jim Rogers XANADU II #90 > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gavin Jefferies [mailto:gj262 at yahoo.com] >Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 3:04 PM >To: Alberg30 Alberg30 >Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions > > >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting >out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point >it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about >30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I >was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't >tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? >Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on >the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years >of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941838613.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:48:37 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:48:37 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38231875.3155EE1F@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Gavin: Your engine trouble could be: a restriction in the fuel system. You could be drawing down the gas in the carburetor until it starves or slows enough that the pump catches up. Could be fuel pump, filter or line, maybe fuel tank or pickup in the tank. Could be ignition - sticky advance mechanism, dirt, carbonized inside the distributor cap or a weak spark coil. I'd try the old process of elimination. It sounds more like fuel to me. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824117.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Fri Nov 5 09:53:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:53:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <4.2.0.58.19991105164250.00af4df0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> Message-ID: <382319B7.52AB214B@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Brian has a good suggestion. Could be points, or a condenser starting to go bad. These often heat up and short, then are ok when they cool down a little and go out again when warm. You wouldn't believe the times it happens on old race car magnetos!! - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941824439.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:21:24 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060921240150.00162733@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" Just pulled my Grey for a rebuild. Same problem. Appears to be valves. Check your compression. If you find a good book let me know as I have been looking too. The best I have found so far is the Atomic 4 manual from Moyer Marine. The Grey is very similar. Parts can be had from Van Ness Engineering in NJ. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898084.0 From apk2 at home.com Sat Nov 6 06:25:01 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 09:25:01 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions In-Reply-To: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <199911060925010600.001978A7@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" I have a Grey manual that was graciously sent to me by Charles Haggert since I didn't have one. I will be more than happy to photocopy it and send it to you if you wish. Alan Andante #152 *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/5/1999 at 12:03 PM Gavin Jefferies wrote: >From: Gavin Jefferies > >Hi, > >Couple of problems with my newly bought Alberg - Sasha 1965 #96. > >The greymarine, which I think is the original engine, has started cutting out. >I'll be motoring along and all of a sudden the revs will drop at which point it >may cut or pick up again. I'm inexperienced with inboard engines and I was >wondering if any list members could recommend a good practical marine engine >maintenance book. > >The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 >degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was >not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced >this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried >to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which >in my case means a trip to a professional. > >Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle >attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the >inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of >over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > >In general I think that I've been sailing too hard and stressing the rigging >more than it can take. Perhaps I should reef in winds greater than 15 knots? > >Any thoughts, opinion, conjecture, greatly appreciated. > >Thanks, >Gavin > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898301.0 From fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net Sat Nov 6 06:32:41 1999 From: fashionguy at mailhost.kal.ameritech.net (greg vandenberg) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 10:32:41 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions References: <19991105200355.24388.rocketmail@web304.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38243C08.710472C1@mailhost.kal.ameritech.net> From: greg vandenberg greg vandenberg wrote: > > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > From: Gavin Jefferies > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by about 30 > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I was > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has experienced > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't tried > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? Which > in my case means a trip to a professional. First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and start over when you reattach the end plate. > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on the > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years of > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the incident? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941898761.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sat Nov 6 07:46:08 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 10:46:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the repair, making for a a ugly job. Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I would appreciate other comments . Jim Allocco --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941903168.0 From gj262 at yahoo.com Sat Nov 6 09:41:16 1999 From: gj262 at yahoo.com (Gavin Jefferies) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 09:41:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <19991106174116.8432.rocketmail@web305.mail.yahoo.com> From: Gavin Jefferies Thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. As regards the incident I've asked the people I lent my boat to for more details but they didn't even notice the damage. I'm not in the habit of lending my boat to people but these are among the very few I would trust her with. They are more used to sailing modern racing boats but I would have thought that the Alberg 30 could more than match new boats for ruggedness/strength, one of the reasons I bought her. Twisting the track I reckon could only happen if the gooseneck locked somehow when tacking or gybing... the boom cannot go forward past the shrouds and the force when going underway seems unlikely to cause such damage... but if the gooseneck could lock or was in the habit of it I would have noticed that when trimming the sails, so I'm stumped. Anyway thanks for everyones advice, I'll let you know how I get on. Gavin > Hi Gavin... I'll try and tackle the mast and boom question. You are not very > clear as to the state of the mast or the boom. It is hard to imagine the > track being pried 30 degrees off line without the mast material being > distorted or bolts being striped. It is my recollection that the track on the > mast is held on with taped screws. I do not think there are any nuts on the > inside of the mast that deal with that track. All you should have to do is > back them out if they have not been wrenched too much by the accident. > > > Gavin Jefferies wrote: > > > > From: Gavin Jefferies > > > The track on the mast that the gooseneck attaches to has warped off by > about 30 > > degrees pulling out most of the screws. I don't know how it happened as I > was > > not on the boat at the time. I'd like to hear if anyone else has > experienced > > this and what was the cause in your case? As far as fixing it I haven't > tried > > to remove the track yet but I suspect that I'll have to lower the mast? > Which > > in my case means a trip to a professional. > > First I must say. I have not sean to many aluminum booms with "alot" of paint > on them. But under that paint there should be some pop rivets. The boom end > (and also the goose neck) should be held on by pop rivets around the > perimeter of the end. Through the boom and into the end plate. These can be > drilled out with a little care and liberal amounts of oil to assist the > cutting action. If need be you could cut off the boom by 1/2 an inch and > start > over when you reattach the end plate. > > > Along the same lines the plate on the end of the boom that the main tackle > > attaches to is also warped. The bolt attached to it seems to be clasped on > the > > inside and in any case the fittings are solidly welded in place from years > of > > over painting. Any ideas as to how I might remove it? > > > Regarding sailing too hard... These boats are capable of being sailed hard. > What you describe is not the result of sailing hard but sounds to me like > mistreatment or an accident of another sort. Do you have anymore info on the > incident? ===== --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941910076.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 20:58:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 23:58:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.bea0e38c.255660fe@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, I don't know what is happening with your mast and boom. I've sailed in 40 plus knots, and had not damage to those areas. The engine problem is either fuel delivery or a bad electrical connection, Hare you a fuel filter? Clean or replace. Perhaps the takn (old) is full of trash. If it almost cuts out, then resumes, it is most likely fuel system problems. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941950718.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 6 21:08:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 00:08:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.c4bfbb0e.25566356@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Gavin, Ah Ha, you lent your boat to some clods, and they screwed it up, and made a pact among themselves not to mention it. Called stonewalling. Don't do that again. Perhaps: they had the boom in the water and draged it, with to much sail on, that could cause damage. or caught it on something. I would press them to find out what happened. and ask for help (money, or time, or both) to repair it. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941951318.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 6 16:43:14 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:43:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <0.da485308.2555a740@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501bf28b9$135399d0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Jim, those without a liner (approx the first 400) have a wooden support beam and those with a liner have an aluminum one. As per the maintenance manual very few of the aluminum support beams have failed, and it appears to be more common on high tension rigs set up for racing. The aluminum support beam + bulkhead system rest on the hull liner and reportedly on some boats (like mine, #466) there is no support under the liner for about 12 inches each side of the centerline. This may cause the liner under the bulkhead to be depressed. On one of the boats, the depressed liner closed off the water hose beneath it. There is a suggested fix in the manual (page C-4). To all the racers out there: what tension would be considered "a high tension rig" for an A-30 ? 900 lbs? 1,000 lbs? More? Jim: is "Barchetta Mia" italian and does it mean "boat of mine" or maybe "small boat of mine" ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, November 06, 1999 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941935394.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 7 07:41:26 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 09:41:26 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991107144212.AAA15531@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Jim: consider this: I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. I believe there is a metal support beam imbedded in glass, but it is nearly on line with the aft edge of the forward hatch. Down below, this would be the very edge of the v-berth, it should look like a two to four inch bulkhead that spans the ceiling between the head area(port side) and the foul weather gear locker (starboard side). Take a look at the photos of the deck opened up at the mast step on my website: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/cprojects.html While routing around, I encountered no metal support beam, so it must be right at the edge of the hatch. Like my boat, I suspect you have compression at the mast step, a symptom wholey un-affected by the integrity of the support beam. What's causing your mast to sink is compressed or damaged core. Bear in mind that the only reason I attempted to fix this problem was because the doors down below where getting stuck because the ceiling was sinking. I believe that the mast step has enough strength, even with the damaged core to support the mast under reasonable tension. Having routed out quite a large area, I can tell you that the damaged area was really very small, maybe 12"x 8". If the deck isn't compressed that much, I'd leave it for a while. I waited over a year to repair mine. After removing the mast and making the repair, the deck sprang right back into place. Truly amazing. Consult anyone of the maintenance manuals for repair options. The most recent version has several articles discussing repairs from the top down, the bottom up, etc. Anyone who discounts the strength of the deck, even with damaged core, should don a pair of safety glasses and watch you try to cut into the deck. Its a serious job, and even ruined core has plenty of strength. If I had to do it again, I might consider repairing from the liner side up, it would leave the deck in tact and save some cosmetic work. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Saturday, November 06, 1999 9:46 AM > > From: Miabarchet at aol.com > > After all the discussion about the support beam I have become concerned . > Barchetta Mia was built in 1974, hull # 565. I was told that Albergs of that > vintage had a metal beam under the liner. Does anyone know if this is > correct. If not I would think the liner would need to be cut away to make the > repair, making for a a ugly job. > > Also this is the first I am winter storing with the mast up. I thought about > relieving some of the tension in the rigging but decided it wasn't necessary > since the coefficeint of expansion of the aluminium mast is greater than > that of the rigging. This would cause the mast to shrink in lenght more than > the rigging thus relieving some of the tension. > > When I tune the rigging in the spring I use a tension gauge and tighten the > forestay and upper and lower shrouds to 15% of their breaking strength . I > would appreciate other comments . > > > Jim Allocco > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941989286.0 From annaro at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 10:32:42 1999 From: annaro at videotron.ca (annaro at videotron.ca) Date: 7 Nov 1999 18:32:42 -0000 Subject: [alberg30] SCHOONER OF DREAMS Message-ID: <941999562.465@onelist.com> From: annaro at videotron.ca Visit one of the most beautiful schooner in the world. 18,000 labour hours have been necessary to built her. For details and many pictures, please, visit http://www.angelfire.com/az/sylba/sailboat.html Welcome to everyone Also, in Cruising World magazine, february issue, article about that schooner on page 26. Your comments are welcome. If you know somebody interested, please, send the above message. Best regards, Roger. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941999562.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 04:13:11 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:13:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <19991107144212.AAA15531%mail.interactive.net@palberg30> Message-ID: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a regular basis. > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 941976791.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 16:20:29 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 19:20:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.b9858ed2.2557714d@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942020429.0 From Miabarchet at aol.com Sun Nov 7 17:21:40 1999 From: Miabarchet at aol.com (Miabarchet at aol.com) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 1999 20:21:40 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> From: Miabarchet at aol.com Joe: Thanks for the info. I currently have none of the conditions you describe,compressed deck, ect. I wrote because with all of the discussion about the delaminated wooden beam I became concerned that my boat would eventualy have that problem . I am relieved to learn that we have a aluminium beam. We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of the mast step. The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for the mast wiring and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly and you know the result. Also water entered the core from the forward hatch hinges. About 5 years ago I repaired the area by opening the holes in the deck to about 1 1/4 " Dia. I only enlarged the holes at the deck level, I did not drill thru to the liner. I also removed the hatch and cut away the deck under the hinges. Then using homemade tools, 3/16" and 1/4" Dia. rod 1 foot long bent sharply at one end and ground to a sharp chisel point I was able to reach between the deck and liner a remove the damaged core. Then using a chalking tube I filled void with epoxy thickened with high density filler. The hinges completely covered the repair so there was no cosmetic work to be done. On the liner under the hinges I epoxyed stainless backup plate for added strength. The holes I repaired by making bronze tubes approx. 5/8' O.D. x 1/2" I.D. long enough to reach from the liner to 1" above the deck. At the deck level ^^ 1' from the end there is a 1 1/4" dia. flange that hides the hole. These I epoxyed in place. Also the top ends of tubes have external pipe threads so they can be capped off during winter storage . I'm sorry for being so wordy but think the info useful for making the repair with no cosmetic work involved. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942024100.0 From gorwin at flash.net Sun Nov 7 20:00:24 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 23:00:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942033624.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 7 21:16:29 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 00:16:29 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.21c62f80.2557b6ad@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Harlan, I 've never had a problem opening the hatch with my boat on a cradle. Perhaps yours is not siting corectly, or too much pressure is being exerted in the wrong places, I would have some one with experience take a look at it. Something is very wrong.. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942038189.0 From cjk at tir.com Sun Nov 7 22:21:00 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 01:21:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <00dc01bf29b1$6def1b00$898b28d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Harlan; Had a similar problem on my A-30 for many years. In my situation I determined the "problem" was a result of the colder temperatures. It appeared that the colder temperature may have caused a slight contraction of either the companion-way hatch and/or the seahood. This slight contraction resulted in the seahood and hatch coming into slight contact with one another and caused a somewhat loud screech when the hatch was opened or closed. This screeching occurred both with the boat in the water and on the "hard." It went away in the spring when things warmed up. It went away permanently over the last winter, but I can't explain why. It may have had something to do with the glass work I had done around the mast step over the winter-just a guess. You might want to remove the seahood and hatch and tighten up the slides on the under side of the hatch and/or file down the lip of the seahood a little. Chet Koop Tanagroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942042060.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 7 15:44:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 18:44:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> Message-ID: <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Harlan, mine does the same thing on the hard or in the water. It's the colder weather that does it for me. As soon as it warms up it goes away. If it is only the teak inlay that rubs against the seahood then maybe it stands too proud of the surrounding fiberglass. I've replaced the teak inlay and it sits maybe 1/16 " higher and not being very good (read dangerous) with a belt sander, I convinced myself that it wouldn't matter. Well now instead of rubbing slightly against the hood when cold now it jams up completely (guess I'll have to practice belt sanding on an old piece of wood). So if the teak inlay has been replaced, look at that. If it is just the fiberglass, remove the seahood and re-install with some kind of a gasket all around it, just enough to raise the hood slightly so there is enough clearance when it's cold. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: Harlan M. Doliner To: Sent: Sunday, November 07, 1999 11:00 PM Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch > From: "Harlan M. Doliner" > > Hello, On Friday we hauled our A30 for the first time and had it set up > on blocks and stands at our house. After being in and out of the boat > several times Friday and Saturday with no problem, today (Sunday) I had > a heck of a time sliding the main hatch over the companionway open and > closed. The edge of the opening in the fiberglass cabin top is rubbing > against the wood veneer on the top of the hatch. We never had this > happen when the boat was in the water or on stands before we bought and > launched her this summer. Today and tonight has been in the 30s and 40s > F. Could the colder temps and varying contractions of wood vs. > fiberglass be the clause? Whether or not it is, any suggestions for a > cure? I'd hate to see the original hatch wood rubbed off every time we > open & close the hatch while we work on the boat this fall and winter. > Thanks much. Harlan Doliner, , Evergreen #489 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942018292.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 8 07:36:37 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:36:37 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new course would be about 60 degrees. I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, etc. Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and genoa) and reefed down. Thanks Tom F. Calliope #287 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075397.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:51:03 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 10:51:03 EST Subject: [alberg30] New Alberg Owner Questions Message-ID: <0.298a8c0b.25584b67@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/6/99 12:41:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, gj262 at yahoo.com writes: << thanks Greg, I couldn't believe it myself but midway along the track it is now twisted 30 degrees to port with the top and bottom still held in place at the correct angle. On my rig there is one bolt at the very top of the track and the rest look like screws. The wood that the track is screwed into is still firmly in place, the middle screws are pulled out and twisted. I'll be going down to the boat on monday to try and take it off myself. >> Hi Gavin, The gooseneck track is usualy extremely well attached, and as time fuses the ss machine screws with the aluminum mast, the union is virtualy inseperable!!! It must have taken some force to wrench that track 30 degrees, as you say. You are lucky that on your boat the wooden spacer is intact. On my boat, #255, all of the wooden track spacers were rotten, and had to be replaced. Only the one under the genny track remains now to be done. either a collision, or a bad jibe, or something of that nature could have provided the force to lift that track, I would guess. I look at the plate on the aft end of the boom that holds the mainsheet tang on my boat with some doubt, as well. If yours has recieved a wrenching force, then repair may be the best prevention to losing the mainsheet on a critical day. Mine is popriveted in place-maybe yours is too. If so, then drill out the pop rivets, and then pry out the endplate of the boom. If after drilling out the pop rivets the plate still will not budge, it is probably the result of years of salt and oxidation wedging in the seam, as well as te paint you mention. I don't like to heat aluminum with a torch to loosen thiings, as aluminum will fatigue so easy, but applying ice to the endplate to shrink it might work. tapping with a light hammer, soaking in kerosene and three and one oil, etc. etc. are all tricks. Once you get it out, I would replace the bolt that holds the mainsheet in place, and then refasten the end plate with machine screws, which you drill and tap threads in for. If when you take the whole thing apart, the end of the boom looks weakened by oxidation, you might consider shortening the boom, ie. cutting it back to strong aluminum that 1/4 inch or so that is necessary, or replacing the end plate with a a fitting with a longer sleeve that will slip in farther to catch strong boom material, or, replace the boom. I would check where the gooseneck attaches, to make sure it wasn't jarred and damaged at the same time as well. May sound like overkill- I can't see what you see of course, and the boom's strength is 'kind of' important. :) hope this helps, Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942076263.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:13:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:13:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <0.7bc1ce2c.255850a8@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/7/99 7:20:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, Miabarchet at aol.com writes: << Guy: Thanks for the information. Barcheta Mia is Italian for "my little boat". My wife thought of it from a line in the song "Santa Lucia". I always say the AL 30 is great for two people in love, and an Italian name adds to the mistique. Jim Allocco "Barchetta Mia" #565 >> Just great....Now you have me wanting to go to Italy. Just great...... :) Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077608.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:17:47 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:17:47 EST Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <0.92946e62.255851ab@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Harlan, I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942077867.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 08:39:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 11:39:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.6871752a.255856ad@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, While not an Alberg 30 topic exactly, just want to share something with you all. If anyone has been thinking of getting a telescope for Stargazing, (gigle), I found a good deal. the Heartland of America catalogue has a Meade 292 60 mm refractor with 4 eye pieces, a diagonal reflector, 3x Barlow, an equatorial mount, and wooden tripod, and a software starfinder, for 99.00. Ours came in the mail on Sat, and we used it for the first time on sunday night. It is a good entry level scope, for the price. We clearly saw the rings of saturn, and the moons of jupiter, and as I learn to use it better, are looking forward to seeing some binary stars, spiral galaxies, and the like. I didn't want to post anything until I actualy used it my self, because at this price, I had great apprehension that it was going to be a piece of JUNK, and I wouldn't see anything. But the scope lists for over 600, and I couldn't find it's replacement model (the 292 has been replaced by the 285) for less than 300 at any discount mail order house. And as I say, the optics are good. Just FYI for all you celestial and budding astronomical sailors out there. Apologies for cluttering the list for those not interested, Lee Stargazer #255 (PS if any skeptics are wondering out there, I'm just writing this out of the excitement I felt at seeing Jupiter's moons for the first time, and I want to share that. I won't get anything if anyone orders the scope) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942079149.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:11:43 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Tom, I've not measured (and I'm not sure I'm a good enough sailor to make a good measurement of the boat's ability) but I think the tacking angle should be close to 90 degrees, certainly not more than 100. The easiest way to lose tacking angle is to have the shrouds too loose, letting the mast sag off to leeward. I'll let better sailors give you better advice, though. - George > -----Original Message----- > From: "Forhan, Thomas" > > Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a > vaguely 20 knot wind, > I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- > i.e., one one > tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after > tacking the new > course would be about 60 degrees. > > I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so > surely that > was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for > improvement on my > boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind > instruments, > etc. > > Still I would like to hear from you all about what your > experiences are- how > close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > genoa) and reefed down. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942084703.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:35:11 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:35:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <0.77d6bc45.25577fa4@aol.com> Message-ID: <000a01bf2a17$fe063fa0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Check all of the holes through your deck. This was an annoying shortcut that Whitby was prone to take. On my boat, all of the holes through the balsa core were left raw. I'm in the process of doing some extensive recoring as a result. Don't let it get to that point. - George > We did at one time have wet core material in the vicinity of > the mast step. > The original owner had drilled two holes in the deck, one for > the mast wiring > and one for the antena cable . These were not sealed properly > and you know > the result. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942086111.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 8 10:52:27 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam In-Reply-To: <001101bf2919$75ecaef0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Guy, It sounds like you may have two problems. The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak and glassing in better support. The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. This calls for opening up the glass, replacing the core and reglassing. It's possible to do so from the underside, but it's infinitely easier to do so from the top. - George > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be > re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with > opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before > opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be > more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at > the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other > telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is > down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close > the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the > door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can > see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if > anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942087147.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 11:09:10 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 14:09:10 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.ea1fa9d4.255879d6@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- LAST CHANCE TO WIN A TRIP TO HAWAII! Must enter by Nov. 9. For details, go to ONElist at: Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942088150.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 8 08:33:10 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:33:10 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <000701bf2a14$b73cf080$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3826FB46.743207C7@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Well, Delaware Bay is not my favorite body of water. Wide as can be but with a narrow channel and you have to dodge big traffic. Even smaller power boats never seem to give way when they are burdened. Only once in 40 years of sailing have I gotten a fair wind on Delaware Bay. Usually it's either flat calm or on the nose. Maybe your poor tacking was the tide against you? I find that having more leading edge helps you point. Maybe a little more genny would have helped. The speed indicator helps me as much as those telltales. As George says, maybe the stays were a little loose. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942078790.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 8 12:57:34 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 15:57:34 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles In-Reply-To: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB02268DA8@hrm06.house.gov> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Tom Forhan wrote; >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new >course would be about 60 degrees. > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, >etc. > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and >genoa) and reefed down. Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. Do the racers have any comment? Bob Kirk --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942094654.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Mon Nov 8 14:05:11 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:05:11 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <4.2.0.58.19991108154815.01ee2e50@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38274915.4FAF2B3C@idirect.com> Well Bob, now that you ask ... the boat was reefed Q: How tight was the foot, was the new clew bladed all the way back to reduce power and improve pointing? Where was the traveller? What was the leach tension, was the leach standing up or badly sagged? Was the boat on her ear? The main is tired, how tired? Draft too far aft? Halyard tension? What were the leach ticklers doing, top one stalling 50%? Jib was rolled, some times Sunstone points slightly better with one roll in the Genoa? What was the wave action? Head stay tension? Shrouds tension? Jib ticklers drawing well? Track car at 45 - 60% sheet angle? How open was the leach? Ticklers stalling evenly up the sail? How old is the sail, draft too far back? Halyard tension? Is the sail a deck sweeper or high cut and is the cloth any good? The cloth you say, well people don't realize it but bias stretch in cloth will undo the best cut sail - THE CLOTH HAS TO BE STABLE that's why some sails cost more than others ALL DACRON IS NOT THE SAME!!!! There is $3.50 per yard Dacron and there is $15.00 a yard Dacron AND IT 'AIN'T THE SAME THING, the expensive stuff is far more stable and will have a much longer usable performance retaining it's shape. So the next time you hear of someone giving a great quote on a new sail, realize it is likely a lower quality cloth. Wind instruments won't make your boat point better, good sails properly set will. Unless you have a neck problem I wouldn't bother with them. Wool on the shrouds, a compass and a knot meter is all you need. You have identified some of the problems you had, in flat water I've had maybe 35 - 40o but most times it is more like 40 - 45o it depends on the conditions. Cheers, John Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > >Tom Forhan wrote; > >Beating down Delaware Bay one night last August into a vaguely 20 knot wind, > >I was disappointed with tacking angles of about 120 degrees- i.e., one one > >tack we would be heading 180 degrees on the compass, after tacking the new > >course would be about 60 degrees. > > > >I think we had one reef and the genoa furled to about 90%, so surely that > >was not optimal. Also I'm sure there is lots of room for improvement on my > >boat: needs a new main, rigging could be tighter, needs wind instruments, > >etc. > > > >Still I would like to hear from you all about what your experiences are- how > >close winded are our boats, both in moderate conditions (full main and > >genoa) and reefed down. > > Tom... I'm not sure your tacking angles are all that bad given the slightly > shortened sail configuration. Last year I took my trusty GPS out and did > some close hauled tack legs out in the Chesapeake Bay under controlled > conditions: Steady course and evenly spaced half-mile tacks both upwind and > downwind. The resulting GPS tracks that I plotted later were regular and > averaged ~90-100 degrees if I remember. Might have done better with tighter > rig, closer sheeting, traveller adjusting, etc, but my conclusion: the > Alberg 30 can't point much better than 45 degrees to the wind. > > Do the racers have any comment? > > Bob Kirk > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Mon Nov 8 16:02:17 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:02:17 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch References: <941877035.7629@onelist.com> <38264AD8.567A@flash.net> <001b01bf297a$1639d120$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38276489.5269@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn Harlan, Ditto to both Guy and Chet's comments. We too have a "screaming hatch" as soon as the weather is consistently below 45-50 F. It goes away when the weather warms up. Last winter I had a good cover and just left it open as I was in and out working on this and that. It would be nice to fix it once and for all. Matthew Wynn Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942105737.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 17:55:40 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 19:55:40 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 hatch Message-ID: <19991109005632.AAA17905@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) I also agree with Russ. Consider the "slight" expanding of the main hatch, but by all means check to be sure that she is blocked properly. Something sounds funny. You would hate to find out next year that she has been warped by a year on the hard in an unfavorable position. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] A30 hatch > Date: Monday, November 08, 1999 10:17 AM > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Harlan, > I agree with Russ whole-heartedly- the boat is being stressed, and the > blocking and jackstands have to be adjusted. Have the yard do it. > Lee > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942112540.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:13:25 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:13:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam Message-ID: <19991109011418.AAA26473@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Guy: you describe exactly what has occurred on "One Less Traveled". I think the extra space at the bottom of the door to the v-berth is the way it came from the factory. If not I won't loose any sleep over it. Clearly the sagging liner is the result of a damaged core. This is not a problem. While slightly disappointing, it can be repaired easily. Consult George's new version of the Maintenance Manual. It is the definitive source of information for these repairs, offering multiple solutions to the problem. Second, consider drilling pilot holes to determine what parts of the mast-step deck area are damaged. If I could re-do I'd have routed a smaller area. Also consider repairing from below, through the liner; there's an article in the Manual about how to do this. Otherwise you will have a large area to repair topsides when it comes time for matching the non-skid and mast-step. If you can't get around to it, so what. Like I said the mast-step will be there for a while- although it may naugh at your conscience a little. PS- email me direct for some more comments on things not to do. This was the biggest Alberg project I tackled so far, and I learned a few lessons. --'course I always learn things the hard way. See my ode to boat restoration (shameless plug): http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/poem.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Support Beam > Date: Sunday, November 07, 1999 6:13 AM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, your web site is very interesting and I'll be checking it out on a > regular basis. > > > I am in the process of repairing the mast step on #499, built 1972. > > On #466, built in 1971, the mast step area will need to be re-done as well. > I noticed this summer that the cabin ceiling interfered with opening the > head door. I had to fold the fore half slightly before opening the whole > door. The lump in the ceiling is noticeable and seems to be more on the port > side of center. Also the v-berth door was rubbing slightly at the top but > only about 1" on both sides of center. Also the other telltale sign was that > rig tension could not be maintained. Now that the mast is down, the ceiling > area has almost resumed its normal position and I can close the v-berth > door. With the v-berth door shut, the distance between the door frame and > the door is not constant, looks normal at the top but I can see into the > v-berth at the bottom. I'm not sure what to make of that, if anything, maybe > it came out of the factory that way. Any thoughts on that ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942113605.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 8 18:36:32 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:36:32 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] A30 sites Message-ID: <19991109013724.AAA7196@mail.interactive.net@palberg30> From: alberg30 at interactive.net (Joe Tokarz) In a effort to escape the civil service, and pursue a foot-loose and fancy free life of penmanship, I am working on a article for the Chesapeake Alberg30 Assoc. newsletter concerning internet websites related to the Alberg 30, or it's restorations, equipment, cruising, etc. If you know of a site, please forward the url address to me by Nov 30 for future publication. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942114992.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:31:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:31:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.aa58d222.2558fda4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob, as a general rule, ypu're right about that 90degree tacking angle, and the conditions have to be pretty good todo that. However, with a racing crew, pretty flat water, 170 headsail with the lead a little farther back, sail almost touching the spreaders, and boom centered, or perhaps a few inches over center, traveler all the way to weather, i've been able to get 85 degrees on a tack. But that's in flat water. normally if you get 90, you're doing great. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121892.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Mon Nov 8 07:45:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 10:45:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Support Beam References: <000f01bf2a1a$67db3a00$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <001701bf2a00$434ba220$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde George, > The normal mast sag of the newer boats is the inner pan sagging under the > weight of the bulkhead. The fix for that involves cutting an > access in the vertical part at the entrance to the forepeak > and glassing in better support. I think you're right about the inner pan sagging. I was looking it over on the weekend and found it was not very stiff at the doorway. Then I looked underneath and saw there was core material attached to the underside of the pan but there seem to be very little fiberglass on the underside of the core (the bilge side). I'm going back to the boat this weekend and will have a closer look. > The bulging of the overhead is probably due to core rot from > water infiltrating the balsa core of the cabin top. I suspect core rot on the mast step area and plan on repairing it. I'm not overly concerned about aesthetics for now (so I'll do it from the top) because my long term plan is to paint the deck and re-do the anti-skid areas with an anti-skid additive. I already have two "flavors" of anti-skid; in some areas it is the original and other areas where core was replaced by the previous owner has a "sponged-in" gelcoat finish whose color does match the rest. Thanks George. Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942075920.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Mon Nov 8 19:47:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:47:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program Message-ID: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on pbs,and there was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm sure some of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock jettys on north and south of light are for protection from ice then its some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in the winter? Now I understand the e-mails of past winter,and present anything to get down to the boat and fix something anything while waiting on spring.Hope Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942119268.0 From gorwin at flash.net Mon Nov 8 20:12:28 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 23:12:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Thanks for the suggestions. The current forecast has Eastern Massachusetts warming up again to the 50s & 60s the next couple of days, so I'll test the cold weather theory first before I get out the rasps, etc. Harlan Doliner, Evergreen, #489 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942120748.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 8 20:19:32 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:19:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, part of it is surely that almost furled, baggy, rollerfurlimg head sail. A working jib would have done MUCH better. second, in a short chop, or bigger waves, you can get a lot more leeway. Sometimes it's the trade off you make to be a little more comfortable, still 120 degrees could be improved upon with the proper headsail selection. One good reason why my rollerfurling headsail and gear, is in my basement. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942121172.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Tue Nov 9 05:43:49 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:43:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles References: <0.9372c5e.2558fad4@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2ab8$9150bd80$20d4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" In flat water, sails set optimally, by AWI I get a wind angle of 43 degrees. I seem to get a 2-3 degree leeway(no current); so the 90 degree tacking angle is a figure I use to navigate with Michael Checkmate #220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942155029.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Tue Nov 9 06:00:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 09:00:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] A30 article Message-ID: <38282910.D3E030B1@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa For those of you interested, an article (complete with pictures) which was written by my son, Christopher, and myself about the restoration of Carina Vela will appear in the January issue of Good Old Boat Magazine. Thanks, Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942156048.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 9 07:17:50 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:17:50 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] PBS Program In-Reply-To: <38279944.70CE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000801bf2ac5$970b7e60$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dick > From: Dick Filinich > > Happen to catch light houses of the east coast saturday on > pbs,and there > was a good portion of the program dedicated to the Chesapeake.The Cape > Henry and especially the Thomas Point caught my attention.I'm > sure some > of you A-30 sailors are familiar with these two lights.If the rock > jettys on north and south of light are for protection from > ice then its > some serious ice.Does the Chesapeake freeze up that solid in > the winter? It can, though it often doesn't. The last time the upper Magothy River froze thick enough to walk across was six years ago. In the winter of 1976 (I think it was) the whole bay froze. They had to send ice-breakers to free watermen caught in the ice or caught in port. A friend of mine was living aboard in Annapolis. He said the ice was really handy for setting up his sawhorses, but the inside of the boat never thawed out. > Ya'll have a mild winter and early spring. Thanks, I hope so. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942160670.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 09:45:58 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 12:45:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Tacking Angles Message-ID: <0.36584ed5.2559b7d6@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, I think reefed as you were, 120 degree tacking angles is not bad. In 20 knots of wind, you can expect to tbe heeled over,and so not as efficient. You will be going fast, so what you lose in pointing, you gain in footing, so the VMG, to sound like Dr. Stuart Walker MD, PITA, is probably good. Check your angles to windward on a 12-15 day, with everything ttrimmed 'optimaly' in your estimation- that would be a more valid test of your rig set up and your sails, and the cleanliness of the bottom, and the drag of the prop and zincs (:)) etc. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942169558.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 11:33:09 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 14:33:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.85f3608b.2559d0f5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/8/99 2:14:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, RABBIT649 at aol.com writes: << m: RABBIT649 at aol.com Lee, What's the URL or 800 # for Heartland of America? Scope sounds like a deal. Great gift item for young Galileos Paul #23 Ashwagh >> Hey Paul, I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly learning what 'right ascension' is!! HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 www.heartlandamerica.com enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942175989.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 9 17:46:59 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 19:46:59 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. 942198419.0 From cjk at tir.com Tue Nov 9 20:13:35 1999 From: cjk at tir.com (Chester & Jan Koop) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 1999 23:13:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <002801bf2b31$f643e5e0$878928d8@default> From: "Chester & Jan Koop" Dick, When re-rigging Tangaroa for single-handed sailing, I installed a new main wire halyard with a rope tail and removed the cable winch from the mast. A new winch was installed on the coach roof winch pad (starboard) with a three gang line stopper in front of that. The rope tail was necessary so as to 1) not mess up the new halyard winch itself, 2) retain the masthead sleeve (designed for cable) and 3) go easy on the hands. As you probably already know those wire winch handles can become lethal weapons if they get away from you. I purchased the halyard (with rope tail attached to the cable) from BOATUS and then cut down the cable to the right length. The critical measurement for me was the length of cable run required to allow for dousing the sail without permitting the rope tail to enter the masthead sleeve and at the same time keep the rope-to-wire connection from coming to rest on the turning block at the base of the mast when in the hoisted position. Chet Koop Tangaroa #445 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942207215.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 9 21:32:20 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:32:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> From: John Birch Personally I like wire with rope tails for the lower stretch of the wire. The solution of reducing dacron stretch with special cores of Kevlar or spectra seem a circuitous and expensive route back to the similar characteristics of wire. Stay with wire, take the mast down and shim the sheave so you won't get a jump and when you change halyards go up a size in the wire. They used to use Tufnell sheaves which can split, get a large diameter aluminium one and make sure the wire can't squeeze between then sheave and side. Some times 1/32 teflon shims will reduce friction but it can't be any thicker. Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. Use Norseman's or Staloc's if you're changing the shrouds. Check out Norseman Marine in Ft Lauderdale Fla. John Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this > has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an > afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the > main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable > wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail > down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as > best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail > whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me > up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done > when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and > repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable > sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the > winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted > from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or > should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good > working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > > "High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich > P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942211940.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:46:27 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:46:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c6851f90.255a60b3@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, just another good reason to take the mast down each winter. When I bought Ca Va, the first winter I found the mast head shiv frozen, as was the jib halyard block. I replaced the jib block, along with the wire rope halyard.( with rope). I removed the shiv, cleaned it, had it machined to take line, lubed it and reinstalled it. What a diference. I threw away that arm breaker of a reel halyard winch. Installed a big regular winch. I had a problem of not being able to lower sail this summer. The first time, after a race, we mannaged to get it down, tuging, and pulling. The second time, it finally pulled a few inches of track away from the mast at the top. One sail slide was too close to the top of the headboard, and came off the track, aparently,. at full hoist. The slide was bent, and we sent someone up the mast to bend the track back. I cut the slide right off the sail for the rest of the summer. It will be replaced this winter, lower. Yep, sure glad I had a crew along. Must have been a terror alone. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942212787.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:51:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:51:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <0.c5fef85b.255a61dc@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, forgot to mention that a machinest friend machined that shiv to take 3/8 " rope. He just cut the groove bigger. clean the sides too, they pick up some gunk over the years. make sure it is very free when you reinstall. Rope is easier, safer, and cheaper to replace. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213084.0 From dans at stmktg.com Tue Nov 9 21:52:06 1999 From: dans at stmktg.com (Dan Sternglass) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 00:52:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Wood Spreaders (was Jammed main Halyard cable) References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38290806.D9AC47A@stmktg.com> From: Dan Sternglass John Birch wrote: > > From: John Birch > ... > Check your spreader bases if they're wood, think about getting a nice pair > of air foils in aluminium. The wood tends to rot in the aluminium sleeve. My experience with the wood spreaders is that there are two things that make them rot, both easily preventable: (1) Not coating the ends and aluminum plates with epoxy, and not using caulking in the screw holes (2) Leaving them on when the tarps are covering the boat in the winter if you're in a place where it snows! Item 2 took me a -long- time (10+ years) to figure out. If the tarps contact the spreaders (hard to avoid), and with the mast horizontal, snow loads will tend to press them down and enlarge the screw holes which are quite close to the edge of the wood. Since I've learned this, I have had no problem with the varnished Red oak spreaders, and they -look- great, especially in light of all the other varnished teak on the boat. BTW, one of the aluminum castings cracked a long time ago, had a new one machined from Aluminum stock by a friend. Said he'd make me two, but only made the one, other (original one) seems fine, though. My $0.02 worth, --Dan Sternglass Watcher of the Skies, 1966, #211, Cayuga Lake, Ithaca, NY --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942213126.0 From baileyje at voyager.net Wed Nov 10 03:30:09 1999 From: baileyje at voyager.net (John Bailey) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:30:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable Message-ID: <000801bf2b6e$f35082c0$bd105dd8@freeway.freeway.net> From: "John Bailey" Dick, I was new this year to sailing. I thought the trouble I was having with the cable halyard was just something I was going to have to live with because I bought an old boat(1964). But one time out in 20 knots the exact same scenario happened. We were not in protected waters so it was pretty exiting for us. Because I had my 16 yr. old rock climbing son with me, we were able to get all but the top battens out before we wrapped the sail around the mast. So, we got out of the situation before any damage was done to the sail. I had the mast taken down so that I could make it the way I wanted. I had the sheave recut for a rope halyard, ran the halyard to the cockpit and it worked perfect all summer. I love it. I'm sure those with more sailing experience could come up with some reasons why the cable is better, but what I have works. the whole setup with blocks to run to the cockpit, new halyard and machine work to the sheave was less than $150. John Bailey "Zevulun" #33 -----Original Message----- From: Dick Filinich To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 9:53 PM Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable >From: Dick Filinich > >Think I'm gonna start a book on my single handed mishaps.I'm sure this >has happened to some of you over the years.Was going out for an >afternoon sail today,work slow in shipyard,three feet from the top the >main halyard cable jammed I was still in protected waters,but the cable >wouldn't go either way.Tried using headsail winch with rope to pull sail >down no luck.I removed sail from boom and wrapped it around the mast as >best I could and return to marina,lost a couple of battens from sail >whipping against shrouds,tore ends of batten pockets.Friend hoisted me >up and was able to drop sail,so now I'm gonna do what I should have done >when I first bought the boat,take the mast down,buff and paint it and >repair anything that looks like trouble.Sheave had wear on it from cable >sliding over it,probably been that way for a while.My boat is 1965 the >winch has a brake on it,maybe original equipment.Has anyone converted >from cable to rope on main halyard?Is it worth the effort to convert or >should I just take the mast down and make sure top hard ware is in good >working order?Any thoughts on this matter will be appreciated. > >"High Spirits"# 191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich >P.S I hope I'm not the only one who goes through these adrenalin rushes. > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233409.0 From apk2 at home.com Wed Nov 10 04:58:14 1999 From: apk2 at home.com (Alan P. Kefauver) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:58:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> <38290363.FF3F4023@idirect.com> Message-ID: <199911100758140720.0030860F@mail> From: "Alan P. Kefauver" That's what happened to me. Andante#152 Alan *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 11/10/1999 at 12:32 AM John Birch wrote: >From: John Birch > make sure the wire can't squeeze between then >sheave and side. . > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238694.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 05:02:19 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:02:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable In-Reply-To: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" I have to stop saying "my new boat" she is already a season old with me, but on my new boat # 150 I am replacing all the standing and running rigging over the winter. I will use 316 ss and reusable fittings on the standing rigging and replace the main wire/rope halyard with braid. When I got her she was pretty shabby and I consider this standard refit stuff. It will cost me close to $ 1,000.00 CND I think. My spreaders are Oak and in perfect condition (they are painted that probably helps). I have steps on my mast, a legacy from her Caribbean days, so I am able to climb up and inspect everything on a regular basis. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942238939.0 From mgrosh at shore.intercom.net Wed Nov 10 05:05:08 1999 From: mgrosh at shore.intercom.net (Michael Grosh) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:05:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <3828CE93.757D@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <015501bf2b80$60e6a600$7ed4b7cc@intercom.net> From: "Michael Grosh" Dick, Look at it this way-those adrenaline rushes are God's way of telling you you are still alive :-) It was probably a mistake using the winch to try to pull down the halyard after it jammed. It is probably locked pretty good between the sheave and the cheek of the block.Anyway, I was able to cure my halyard problem with the mast in place. After getting the halyard back where it belongs on the sheave, drill through the side of the mast and tap for 3/16"or 1/4" machine thread. Run a nut up the SS bolt,put a lock washer on the end of the bolt. Screw the bolt into the mast (the hole being where the bolt will push against the cheeks of the block), then set the locknut . I try to live by the rule "the best way is the easiest way" but this repair has held up for me for about 15 years now, although I have adjusted the bolt several times (I never-seize _everything_). I also don't tempt the fates-when raising and lowering the main, I always try to keep the tail of the halyard in column with the sheave, if you follow. Michael Checkmate#220 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942239108.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Wed Nov 10 03:39:09 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:39:09 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main Halyard cable References: <000001bf2b7b$d38d7c60$752bfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <3829595D.7D312FD4@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White What kind of steps? I think I'd like that. I am going to have to replace the lifelines as rust is showing through... Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942233949.0 From mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca Wed Nov 10 16:52:15 1999 From: mattwynn at ns.sympatico.ca (Matthew Wynn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:52:15 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Re: A30 hatch References: <942049688.1859@onelist.com> <38279F2C.2E20@flash.net> Message-ID: <382A133F.2770D1DE@ns.sympatico.ca> From: Matthew Wynn > Harlan, I'd be hesitant to use a rasp on the underside of the sea hood. It seems to me that it needs all the strength it can get. Someone walked on my seahood at a wharf this summer and it sagged somewhat. I also found a slight crack on the rolled edge facing the hatch and cockpit. I have been wondering if there is anyway to strengthen the leading edge of the seahood. Guy's idea of shimming up the seahood sounds like a good idea to me. Just some thoughts. Matthew Tazar #424 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942281535.0 From hughfree at hotmail.com Wed Nov 10 17:48:52 1999 From: hughfree at hotmail.com (Hugh Freebairn) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:48:52 PST Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders Message-ID: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942284932.0 From gallen at vcn.bc.ca Wed Nov 10 17:58:01 1999 From: gallen at vcn.bc.ca (John Allen) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:58:01 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 10 05:57:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:57:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast Step Plate Message-ID: <001601bf2b83$76c586f0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> I will be undertaking the job of repairing the core at the mast step area sometime early next spring (wish I had an indoor location where I could do this over the winter). There are a few screws holding the mast step plate down, what do they screw into ? Are there nuts inside the fiberglass-core-fiberglass sandwich or are they like self-tapping screws ? To those who have already done this repair, are the screws difficult to remove (seized up ? ) ? Any special recommendations for removing them ? Cheers to all. Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 10 18:17:00 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:17:00 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland In-Reply-To: <000e01bf2be8$3038d060$a24066cf@user> Message-ID: <000b01bf2bea$d6f3b260$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, Welcome to the Alberg 30 mailing list. You may wish to join the Alberg 30 Association, too. I just recently published a small article on this topic in the newsletter. Are your new fuel tanks mounted on the outboard or inboard side of the cockpit lockers? You can (or, rather, I can) reach the rudder post packing gland with one hand by lying down in the aft lazarette locker and reaching under the cockpit. You may be able to tighten it this way, but I wasn't. I couldn't loosen the lock nut from this position. I was successful by removing the aft half of the plywood inboard of the port cockpit locker. I cut this plywood straight down from the aft edge of the rectangular hole at the top. Then I drilled out the rivets and broke loose the fiberglass tabbing. It was then easy to reach and adjust the rudder packing gland. I replaced the plywood panel using screws along the top and bottom edges. - George "Calypso", #543 -----Original Message----- From: John Allen [mailto:gallen at vcn.bc.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:58 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland I'm a first-timer to this site so please be kind. In the process of getting to the stuffing box for the rudder shaft which has been leaking enough to cause my bilge pump to cycle much too often. I have already replaced the original fuel tank with two Tempo tanks in the laxarettes, port and stbd. so am faced with removing the engine to access the shaft. Any tips would be appreciated. "Skybird" 1973 A-30, Atomic 4 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286620.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 18:11:17 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:11:17 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder shaft packing gland Message-ID: <0.35db57b4.255b7fc5@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com One of the first major chores I did on Isa Lei was to cut an access through the starboard deck locker. Essentially all I did was use my saber saw and cut a big hole in the plywood side (Don't cut the cockpit sole). I saved the cutout and put it back with two 1x3 pine battens screwed to the cutout and the remaining plywood. Now when I need to get behind the engine, all I have to do is empty the locker, remove the access panel, crawl in and pray that there aren't any little kids around to learn the strange words that I use. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942286277.0 From zira at mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 22:11:32 1999 From: zira at mindspring.com (David Swanson) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:11:32 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Spreaders & Halyard Sheaves (shivs?) Message-ID: <382A5E14.673CBB1E@mindspring.com> From: David Swanson Hello - My boat came with aluminum spreaders with wood bases - obviously a homemade set up. I made new ones of tubular aluminum & aluminum bases, which work ok but are angled about 2 degrees forward. I was planning to make a new set, and was able to pick up someairfoil ones from a Catalina 30 for $10. All of which is a round about way of asking if anyone else has had any aluminum ones made lately, and if so, who did it & what was the cost? To you guys who switched to rope main halyards by re-machining the pully, what size line do you use? What is the inner diameter of the pulley now? Does the halyaerd rub on the forward or rear edges of the mast? Thanks. dls Strayaway Child Alberg 30 #229 P.S. Sunny & 78 degrees today here in NC. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942300692.0 From gorwin at flash.net Wed Nov 10 18:36:08 1999 From: gorwin at flash.net (Harlan M. Doliner) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:36:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Hatch Mystery Solved References: <942224369.14713@onelist.com> Message-ID: <382A2B98.7EB9@flash.net> From: "Harlan M. Doliner" Today Evergreen basked in unseasonably high temps of 70+F. Upon arriving home this evening I climbed up into the cockpit and had a marvelous time easily sliding a very slick hatch back and forth without any rubbing against the seahood. (Anyone watching would have thought me a little odd). It's a real relief to learn it's the temperature differential. Veteren's Day will now be spent rigging a good tarp cover so the hatch can be left open to work on her when the temps return to more normal levels. My thanks to all those who ventured opinions on this problem. Now if only a change in temperature could repair the split in the mainsail... Harlan Doliner, Everygreen, #489. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942287768.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:18:28 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:18:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Telescope Message-ID: <0.de555226.255baba4@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Thanks Lee. Now what tells me you've had this longstanding interest in "Stargazing"? Happy azimuths! Paul #23 Ashwagh In a message dated 11/9/99 2:33:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, FINNUS505 at aol.com writes: > Hey Paul, > I am so psyched! I took out about 10 books from the library; I'm finaly > learning what 'right ascension' is!! > HearlandAmerica, Nov. 1999. 1-800-229-2901 page 38 item PB-5234 > www.heartlandamerica.com > enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942297508.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 04:53:28 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:53:28 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard solution Message-ID: <0.36703fd8.255c1648@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, When I bought Stargazer, 1967 #255, alot of her gear was original, and worn, and scary!.... The Main halyard sheave was the original composite material one, and wobbly and worn, and the retaining plates were badly pittted and oxidised, and wobbly, and there was more than enough room for the meathook laden, wire halyard that did not reach the deck, to jump that sheave and jam. I got a qoute from a reputable Annapolis rigger to replace the parts in anodized aluminum for about 3oo bucks. In the sailing forum chat room, someone told me about Tartan Yachts in Ohio, and that the T27 had a very similar sheave arrangement, and they still made replacement parts. One phone call got me a qoute of 100 bucks or so for an industrial delrin type sheave of the exact Alberg 30 dimensions, new retaining plates, the bolt, and the compression tube. I mailed everything I had to Joe for templates. The parts were beautifuly made. I opted to forgo the annodizing, because on thse parts it gets worn off anyway, and with anual maintaince (grease) it should be OK, and I got the retaining plates made in double the original thickness, and ground out the mast slot accordingly. (Very slowly and carefull!!!!) I don't have the # with me here, but if you contact Tartan Yachts, and then ask for the service dept. I spoke to a fellow named Joe, who made the parts. Dealing with people in the Midwest is usualy a pleasure. I changed the meathook laden wire halyard with a StaSet double braid one. I made the new halyard long enough so the shackle could reach the deck, or the water. I never liked that A30 Halyard that could not reach the deck-too easy to lose hold of when the boat is knocking around, and then you can't use the main halyard in an emergency for something else, without having to tie another line to the shackle to lengthen the halyard. Hope this helps, Dick. Love your stories!! Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942324808.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 11:15:24 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:15:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942347724.0 From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 10:36:41 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:36:41 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders In-Reply-To: <19991111014852.99351.qmail@hotmail.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" Hugh. Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no complaints. Doug Candy Cane, #583 PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders From: "Hugh Freebairn" Hi every one, Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? I'd like to replace my wood ones. Hugh Freebairn Aliage #442 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942345401.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 18:50:43 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 20:50:43 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382B8082.4104@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Thanks for all the imput on the jammed halyard issue.Today played hookey from work and motored up bayou lafourche for three hours where I work and lifted the mast off in an hours time,pays to have a free cherry picker and operator to boot.Sheave froze solid with rust,didn't get a very close look at the rest of the hardware had to make the return trip back to marina near the gulf arriving well after dark.Tomorrow heck I'll take the rest of the week off and have a long weekend and start buffing off old paint and have a new back stay made to replace the one I have now with those insulators on it.Someone on the told me stay was used for antenna,well I gonna get rid of that pain in the butt hanging my topping lift every time I sail.Gonna get the yard machinist to turn a new stainless sheave for wire for now.If I could get my hands on a rope winch pretty quick I would have liked to make the transition.New orleans is the closest place where sail shops are located and thats an hour and a halfs drive.Are winches sized by cat head diameters,what size winch would be right for my boat.The winch I use for hoisting the head sails is small about 2 1/2 inch diameter drum,but strong enough to hoist me up and I weigh 160.Some time back someone on the list mentioned the tickness of the metal in the mast well mines is heavy,didn't put a mic to it but looks 1/8"or better wall thickness,check it tomorrow.Now everyone can ubderstand why cabin sags and have to keep cutting the tops off the v-berth doors.Ha!Ha!Hey Lee you say you enjoy my stories,my wife keeps telling me she's gonna get a call form some one down in Puerto Rico or someplace telling her they found my boat adrift with onone aboard.Stories ,brother I worked in the middle east for 9 years I could keep you in stiches but thats not an A-30 related subject.Hey gang once again thanks for the imput,and I'll let ya'll know how things turned out and see what kinds of new adventures await. Still "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick Fillinich --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942375043.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 11 19:07:41 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 21:07:41 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Short cajun humor Message-ID: <382B847D.65FC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This deals a little with navigation so its boat related. Boudreaux(Boo-drow) went to a place of employment looking for a job and was sent there by thibodeaux.The person hiring asked mr Boudreaux if he had any skills and Boudreaux replied why sure I cut sugar cane,well the the hiring personel said oh mr boudreaux thats not a skill thats common labor.Boudreaux replied well you hired thibodeaux,and the company man shot back but Mr. Thibodeaux is a pilot,yah said Boudreaux I cut it and he pile it. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942376061.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 19:52:49 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 22:52:49 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the list would be 'bored'!! Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the change. I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in the past few months. Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so no one would loosen it by accident. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942378769.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 11 20:32:22 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:32:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders References: Message-ID: <382B9855.7F7E7517@idirect.com> From: John Birch $300 CDN at Klacko for airfoil spreaders for Sunstone, great quality, used same base style as the old wood one's in rectangular solid aluminium at the base for through bolting. No modifications necessary to the mast or spreader bracket. Recommended. Cheers, John Doug Stevens wrote: > From: "Doug Stevens" > > Hugh. > Not knowing where you are makes things a little difficult but if you are > anywhere in the Toronto area I would suggest Klacko Spars Ltd., 663 Third > Line, Oakville, Ontario, L6L 4A9, Phone 905-825-0015 or fax 905-825-5353. > They manufactured both my mast and spreaders several years ago and I have no > complaints. > Doug > Candy Cane, > #583 > PS. If you are in the states I'm sure they can still help and save you about > 40% on U.S./Cdn.$ exchange rate. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Hugh Freebairn [mailto:hughfree at hotmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 8:49 PM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: [alberg30] aluminum spreaders > > From: "Hugh Freebairn" > > Hi every one, > > Anyone know where to find aluminum airfoil spreaders for an A30? > I'd like to replace my wood ones. > > Hugh Freebairn > Aliage #442 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942381142.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:18:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:18:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.18b5c7e7.255cfd16@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, a usefull suggestion. When you have a new backstay made up, put a Johnson backstay adjuster on it. Less than $150 (I think) it 's simple, strong, and it works wonderfully. You don't need to keep a lot of tension on the rig, except when you are sailing. A few turns tighter, helps pointing, and sail set. As long as youre makeing one up........Remember to loosen it when you get ready to leave her. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942383894.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 11 21:26:16 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 00:26:16 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.7cab3929.255cfef8@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, reguarding winches, yours sounds a little small. The rule is the bigger the better, within reason but I don't think I would want my body on that winch. Different makers have different rating systems. Perhaps you can find a used one also. Take a look around at other boats, to see what size they are using, and remember, that main is 200 square feet, and the boom is heavy. Just my opinion. Russ Pfeifer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942384376.0 From chaggart at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 11 22:42:15 1999 From: chaggart at sympatico.ca (Charles Haggart) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 01:42:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps In-Reply-To: <0.7aa3093f.255c6fcc@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> From: "Charles Haggart" Lee: The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. I assume they have been on the boat for 18 years and they show no signs of wear. I have used them a dozen times so far this season alone to check things out. I am happy that they are there and I can understand their usefulness on an extended cruise. Hi Charles, You mention mast steps in your last post; Did you put them on yourself? If so, what brand were they, how did you fasten them, and would you recommend them? Thx, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942388935.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Thu Nov 11 22:51:59 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:51:59 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps References: <000001bf2cd9$0ff67a40$513cfea9@black-point> Message-ID: <382BB90F.2E960F18@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Charles: Thanks. T-6 is a pretty good heat-treatable alloy. Sound like good stuff. I don't know about corrosion resistance, but I suppose that depends on the finish. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942389519.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 06:01:11 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 09:01:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.38142273.255d77a7@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Thx Charles. Seems like such a good, simple idea. Lee The mast steps were on the boat when I got her. Included in the ton of paper I got with the boat is a single sheet of paper (dated May 30 1981) describing the "ARIMA" mast steps in all their glory. They are made from Aluminium Alloy 6061-T6 ( what ever the hell that is) and cost ( in 1981 dollars) $ 5.25. They are fastened with 316 ss round head 10-24 screws. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942415271.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 12 17:13:48 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:13:48 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942455628.0 From tristan at one.net Fri Nov 12 12:31:44 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:31:44 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <382CBA7B.30DE@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <382C791C.217061F5@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Dick, Congratulations on your prompt follow-up in restoring your vessel! Our friends, Tom and Clara Church sail their 38 LOD Nor'Wester, a 1926 Alden schooner, down the Mississippi almost every Fall and winter on Lake Ponchatrain with sails into the Gulf and sometimes off to Florida...This winter they are stuck on the hard in their homeport of Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on Lake Michigan...They do love the "Nah ahlanns" area! Good Sailing, Scott Wallace Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > What I thought to be a rusted steel sheave turns out to be when I pulled > it out today,is a material called marcarta.Machinist says its is used in > electrical systems switch boards,boxes etc.The lip was worn down on one > side,gonna replace with a self lubricating nylon type of material we use > as wear plates on offshore steering systems.Lee things were as you > describe alum.plate either side with s.s bushing on s.s bolt.I'm just > getting back from New Orleans had a new back stay made up $134.20 with > new fittings,but different at top,thimble and eye changed out with > marine eye,rigger said 1x19 cable should not be bent into an eye.I'll > try ebay but today I was given a number for a company called Traditional > Marine Outfitters 1-800-363-2628 to maybe locate a winch.My head sail > winch has a #2 on it.Lee I'll send you another cajun humor > direct.Charles in Dubai, McDermotts yard personnel called us off shore > trash,been to the north sea Great Yarmouth,drop me a line.While waiting > on new backstay found North Sails loft and priced new set of sails how > would this compare to northern prices Main 7 0z 2 reefs 4 battens 247 > s.q ft. $1284 ,152% 5 0z. genoa 287 sq.ft. $1070,100% jib 7 oz. 180 > sq.ft. $908 all sails of dacron with bags,leechline,cross panel > layout.This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've > made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying > but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble > on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange > ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942438704.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 12 21:17:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 00:17:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.a870f9df.255e4e7e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ddick, those sail prices sound like they are in the ballpark. Have an extra, flatening reef put in the main. All it is consists of a reinforced patch with an earing in it at the leach, about 10 inches above the boom, for another line. To use it, you only pull hard. leave the main halyard alone. It's great as the wind builds. flatens out the main for less heeling. And don't forget that backstay adjuster. Cheaper to do it all at the same time. Reggards, Rus Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942470270.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Fri Nov 12 18:24:56 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 21:24:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks Message-ID: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Talk about limiting access, check out the following configuration which was done by a previous owner. On #466 (1971) there is a metal tank under the cockpit floor which in my opinion extends a little too far forward over above the stuffing box, so if there were an inspection port in the cockpit floor, one would not be able to access it anyhow. Mine has wheel steering and the pedestal is placed at the forward end of the cockpit, so there is no inspection port. Trying to get at it from the inside is another story. 466 has a Volvo Penta diesel model 2002 which has a high profile compared to an Atomic 4. So trying to squeeze in from the inside to access anything behind the engine is almost impossible. Even trying to access the gate valves where the deck and cockpit drains connect to is difficult. Last week I removed all the other gate valves (which were all bronze) and it was a good thing because they were badly corroded and / or seized and I had to use a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to remove them (those Dremels are great). I put off replacing the ones behind the engine because of access. Inaccessible and possibly seized gate valves could present a safety hazard. Also you want easy access if ever you had to re-align the transmission and shaft alignment. So plan your installation carefully, taking the above into consideration. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, November 12, 1999 11:06 PM Subject: Re: [a30] Tanks > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > I had a freind install a tank under the cockpit floor. He regretted limiting > the access to the engine thru the 'inspection port', which became his filler > port. I would say weigh the pros and cons carefully before you do it. > In a message dated 11/12/99 8:42:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, > Brian.Walter at ACAD.WSCC.CC.TN.US writes: > > > From: Brian Walter > > > > Thanks for all the info on the tanks. My thinking has been that I need to > > use the space under the cockpit as it is realively inaccessible and so not > > good for anything else, > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942459896.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Sat Nov 13 02:54:29 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 10:54:29 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Fw: [a30] Tanks References: <001301bf2d7e$46e7d170$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <382D4365.A3AB7EDE@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White An opinion on installing wheel steering: When I put a wheel on my Alberg last spring all the advice I got was to leave plenty of room behind it in the cockpit. It ended up about midway in the cockpit sole. After a season of use I wish I had put it as far aft as gave me foot room in front of the top of the rudderpost - about five inches aft of where I put it. (I tried the placement with a mocked-up wheel before installing it) It is ok, but restricts cockpit sitting room more than necessary. - Gordon White A-275 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942490469.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 13 08:30:26 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:30:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942510626.0 From tristan at one.net Sat Nov 13 04:20:38 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:20:38 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner References: <0.ae9c5d9e.255eec22@aol.com> Message-ID: <382D578F.83EC4D0E@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Did you get a good deal? An Alberg 30 in good condition for $15,000 is a good deal! For $1500 I can only imagine :) Scott THOMASHMCD at aol.com wrote: > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, > California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the > rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were > unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial > # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where > would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any > photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! > > Tom M. > Kittypoo, # ? > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942495638.0 From john at cep.ca Sat Nov 13 09:21:03 1999 From: john at cep.ca (John Edwards) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 12:21:03 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] New A30 Owner Message-ID: <382D9DFE.A4E4420@cep.ca> From: John Edwards Hello: I believe that the serial number means 30ft. Boat built in 64 hull # 49. As for the price yes you got a deal. -- John Edwards CEP National Representative phone: 416-622-2740 x237 fax: 416-620-0781 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942513663.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 11:57:08 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 14:57:08 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.cb477a55.255f1c94@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/12/99 8:14:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, daf at mobiletel.com writes: << This great deal I made on the boat,with all the improvements I've made new engine etc. is still less than some boats I looked at buying but were getting close to that invisible line.Hey folks sorry I ramble on my e-mails,but you are the only people I get a chance to exchange ideas with and learn. "High Spirits"#191 Galliano,La. Dick >> "That Invisible Line".......I like that, Dick. I passed it long, long ago........ Your sail prices seem fair, for the big national lofts. In 'Soundings' magazine, in the classifieds, there are quite a few discount sail lofts listed. A few phone calls might save you a bundle!!! And remember, the lofts really do cut their prices significantly at the boat shows, so it is worth waiting for if your buying a whole set. Have fun, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942523028.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 13 12:48:44 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:48:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] A 30 rudder and plans Message-ID: <0.46bcc9a9.255f28ac@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com OMASHMCD at aol.com I have recently purchased an A30 sitting in dry storage in Marina Del Rey, California. This is the boat that I had asked for help with rebuilding the rudder. The rudder was hit by a car and destroyed, then the pieces were unfortunately thrown away so I don't have much to go on! There is a serial # 306449 on the plate in the cockpit. Is this hull # 449? If not, where would I find the hull #? I paid $1500 for her. Did I get a good deal? Any photos or plans detailing the rudder would be greatly appreciated! Tom M. Kittypoo, # ? Tom, You are going to change that name, aren't you? But seriously, for 1500.00, you have a good deal, no matter what she needs. Carl Alberg's plans were all archived at the Peabody Museum in Salem Mass. after he passed away. When I had my Alberg 22, it was no trouble to get a copy of the complete set of plans of her from them, for about 90.00. When I bought this alberg 30, I wanted to get her plans too, just to have. Apparently they are not at Peabody, and were bought by Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. I called them several times, and the owner was never in, and the receptionist could never help me, and I eventualy stopped persuing them. Here is the phone # from their full page ad in the A30 Handbook. 803-252-8210 adress;PO Drawer 50126, columbia, sc 29250 Now that you've opened this old wound for me...:).....I'm going to try to reach him again, because it would be nice to have a copy of the hull lines, construction plan and sail plan as Carl drew them. For you, it sounds like an absolute necesity if you want the proper rudder. Of course, if you can't get the originalspecs, there is no reason why you can't build a rudder of proper size and strength either, it just may differ from the original specs. Welcome aboard, shipmate. You've got a great boat. I'd like to hear what other projects you have to do to get her sailing. Lee trachtenberg Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942526124.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 13 16:56:27 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 16:56:27 PST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <19991114005627.57287.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, nice to know that our "Tradewinds" younger brother is alive and well in California. Your numbers mean that your boat was built in 1964, is 30 feet long and is hull number 49. And you got a great deal!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #306448 or just plain #48 P.S. In case your interested we're located in Southern Michigan. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942540987.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 05:15:27 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.da81aa8c.25600fef@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942585327.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Sun Nov 14 05:38:25 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.2d666ec5.255ce911@aol.com> Message-ID: <382EBB51.5769@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942586705.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 14 06:42:58 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942590578.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 10:27:02 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Mast Step Removal Message-ID: <19991114172840.OJSN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604022.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:37:24 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] New A30 owner Message-ID: <0.6669f39a.25604d54@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942601044.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sun Nov 14 09:56:05 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ccd77b1d.256051b5@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942602165.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Sun Nov 14 10:52:27 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB022E8052@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942605547.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 14 11:58:50 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Hell yes! Message-ID: <19991114185827.OLMU2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942609530.0 From walshe at unixg.ubc.ca Sun Nov 14 10:36:29 1999 From: walshe at unixg.ubc.ca (walshe) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? References: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: <382F012C.B088EA4A@unixg.ubc.ca> From: walshe Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942604589.0 From bobjns at nais.com Sun Nov 14 13:24:19 1999 From: bobjns at nais.com (Bob Johns) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? In-Reply-To: <0.c1d12592.25602472@aol.com> Message-ID: From: Bob Johns Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942614659.0 From jsss at net1plus.com Sun Nov 14 15:30:48 1999 From: jsss at net1plus.com (Joyce Sousa) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] name change Message-ID: <382F4627.8CCF9D76@net1plus.com> From: Joyce Sousa When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942622248.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Sun Nov 14 18:10:21 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (Joseph Fleming) Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail Message-ID: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> From: Joseph Fleming I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942631821.0 From andyv at intergate.bc.ca Sun Nov 14 22:20:45 1999 From: andyv at intergate.bc.ca (Andy Vine) Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> From: "Andy Vine" As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942646845.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 07:08:22 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 10:08:22 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Heaving to under sail In-Reply-To: <19991115021021.22482.qmail@aw163.netaddress.usa.net> Message-ID: <000901bf2f7b$42d80740$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I've never hove-to in a storm, but the A30 heaves-to very easily. Just tack the boat without releasing the jib and then push the tiller up until she balances. - George > From: Joseph Fleming > > I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know > if there is anyone out there who has had any experience > heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats > react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your > sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other > reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942678502.0 From kazz at tir.com Mon Nov 15 13:50:20 1999 From: kazz at tir.com (kazz) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:50:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <005b01bf2fb4$a1edd3c0$a48928d8@default> From: "kazz" A Beefeater martini, extra dry and "up" works well. Pour gently! -----Original Message----- From: Rap1208 at aol.com To: alberg30 at onelist.com Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind >all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at >appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. >Russ Pfeiffer > >> --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942702620.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Mon Nov 15 15:46:06 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 18:46:06 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Hello to all. I am another relatively new Alberg 30 owner having purchased Delphi, #40, a 1964 boat, which I am trying to bring back to proper form. I was pleased to find this forum because like any new owner, I have lots of questions about the proper way to repair/rebuild the various things that need fixing. I also had to deal with the mast step before I could put any strain upon the mast. The glass around the step was fine but the upper portion of the mast step on my boat was cracked in several places around and through the bolt holes. This is the piece that has the shoe or heel that the mast fits over. The bottom piece that is bolted to the deck over the main beam was still in good shape. The top piece had welded itself to the mast and could only be removed with brut force. Needless to say it became several more pieces by the time it was out of the mast. I was told by a friend with a machine shop that the aluminum casting was too contaminated to be properly welded together. We cut the heel portion from the rest of the casting and bolted it(and bedded with 3M5200)to a stainless steel plate that was slightly larger than the original casting. Bolt holes (slots) were cut in the plate for the mast step bolts and the four edges of the plate were punched with holes and then bent up at a 45% angle to provide attachment points for blocks and halyards. The purpose was to provide an easy way to lead the halyards back to the cockpit. It seems to work well but the front portion needs to be bent more or cut off because it interferes with the opening of the forward hatch more than about 75 degrees. Question-the mast step is designed to have about an inch of play fore and aft in its location. Is there a preferred position? I put the new step back where the original was located ( as near as I can tell ) with the bolts in the center of the slots. Would moving it forward or aft change the balance or have much effect on trim or pointing ability? Ross Horton Delphi, #40 -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 at onelist.com [mailto:alberg30 at onelist.com] Sent: November 15, 1999 3:29 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 439 There are 13 messages in this issue. Topics in today's digest: 1. Re: New A30 owner From: FINNUS505 at aol.com 2. Re: Jammed main halyard From: Dick Filinich 3. Re: Name change? From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com 4. Re: Mast Step Removal From: "alberg30" 5. Re: New A30 owner From: Rap1208 at aol.com 6. Re: Name change? From: Rap1208 at aol.com 7. Re: Name change? From: walshe 8. RE: Name change? From: "Forhan, Thomas" 9. Re: Name change? Hell yes! From: "alberg30" 10. Re: Name change? From: Bob Johns 11. name change From: Joyce Sousa 12. Heaving to under sail From: Joseph Fleming 13. Prop size for Atomic 4 From: "Andy Vine" ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 08:15:27 EST From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Hi Tom, Just to add to what I said yesterday, it seems most of the A30 owners are the kind of people who enjoy tinkering on and repairing their own boats, so there is plenty of advice here for you. The boats are all very similar, and after 30-40 years, have similar upkeep/repair needs, so most likely, what ever it is you have to do, someone on the list has done it already!!!! So ask first, if you don't feel like re-inventing the wheel. Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 07:38:25 -0600 From: Dick Filinich Subject: Re: Jammed main halyard FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Yes, I enjoy your stories. Send me some to my emai adress if you think the > list would be 'bored'!! > Lucky you have pals that can make you a sheave. when you take it out, you'll > see the sheave rides on a compression tube of aluminum, which slides over a > SS bolt. It was all frozen on my boat and had to be cut with a Sawzall. The > Mast was fine, and I agree, it is a nice thick extrusion. It was the > retaining plates, the two aluminmum plates that the sheave rides inbetween, > that I had made double thickness. Worked out well, and I would recommend the > change. > I would also strongly recommend going to an all rope halyard. These days, > the StaSet, or staset X stretch as little as SS wire, and without the splice > to thimble junction limiting the run of the halyard, the line becomes more > versatile. Have your buddy retool the sheave for rope. if the retaining > plates are smooth and lead fairly, and you keep the halyard centered when > sailing, and tied to the boom when the boat is not being used, then chafe > should not be a problem. But if you ever run aground, and time is running > out, like the tide is ebbing, and you want to use your main halyard to heel > the boat over briefly to decrease drafft, and float her off, then the rope > halyard, with an extra long tail, might save the day. Might help in > retreiving a man overboard, too, in a pinch. > Alot of Alberg 30's haveno mainhalyard winch- you just hauled up the sail to > the top, belayed, and then fixed luff tension with the downhaul, which is > attached to the boom. Stargazer has an old bronze #2 Southcoast winch for > the main halyard, and properly cleaned and greased, it does just fine. You > can get one, second hand, for under 50 bucks. Ebay on AOL has had a few in > the past few months. > Stargazer came with one of those wire halyard winches with the wire being > captive on a drum, with a brake, for the genny halyard, and I have heard too > many stories of sailors being hurt by these, when the brake slips under > pressure, and the handle, still attached, becomes a mad, self driven weapon. > But I needed a genny halyard winch, so I modified it as follows- > !) changed the halyard to double braid Sta-Set. > 2)using a Sawsall (yes, I like that tool!!) I cut off the guard on the bottom > of the winch that helped keep the wire spooled on the drum. This enabled me > to just use the drum for three wraps of line, like a normal winch. > 3) tightened the brake maximaly, manualy, and taped off the brake handle so > no one would loosen it by accident. > Hope this helps, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Lee and All.Yesterday spent the day dee rigging my mast and examined every single piece of hardware that came off,and buffed the whole mast and spreaders down to bare metal.There was only one crack and that was in the mast to spreader mounting bracket,its about a 1/2 " long not even gonna fool with it.My mast is 35' exactly.I contacted Traditional marine outfitters,there in Nova Scotia and cold as a grave diggers butt.While I wait for word on winch with Tim with company,I'm going down to my boat this morning and check if one of my spinnaker winches will replace cable winch.If I'm lucky I have the mast up by next weekend maybe.I can always replace spinnaker winch at my leasure,Cable winch bolts are frozen solid to aluminum to get it off probably will mean a useless winch when I finish.You like a sawsall,well we get lots of use from a weapon we call a metabo blade.Thin carbon blade that replaces buffing or grinding wheel on 4 1/2" mini grinder.Stainless steel does not cut with a torch ,but be careful with this use heavy leather gloves,this blade can cut to the bone in a heart beat.Gonna go with new lights while I've got the mast down,and the spreaders and upper shroud chain plates?will be painted black to break up that powder puff all white appearance."High Spirits"# 191 Dick ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 09:42:58 EST From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Lee, Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel puts her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me that even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think so! Tom Undecided, #49 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:27:02 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Mast Step Removal Guy: Sorry its taken so long to get back to you. A couple of thoughts on the mast-step repair. 1) When I removed my mast-step plate, the whole plate and screws corroded in place came out of the deck with some prying. I tried unsuccessfully for some time to unscrew the bolts that went into the deck, but they wouldn't budge. Thus the whole thing eventually came out. I have tried to get the bolts out of the plate after the fact, but haven't been able to. I read in one Maintenance Manual article where a guy drilled them out then retapped the plate. 2) The mast-step doesn't bolt or screw into anything other than the deck, which is basically fiberglass and the core. It doesn't even through bolt through the deck. I asked this question once before, and everyone seems to agree that the bolts in the mast-step plate are really just "feet" meant to keep the mast from "walking" away. I don't really like this idea, but perhaps this is what has allowed A30's to be demasted (like Yves Gelinas #399 "Jean de Sud") and not have damage to the coach roof. If you were to through bolt the mast-step, upon demasting, would you have the coachroof ripped open? Does it matter? There is,however, an article in the Maintenance Manual where a guy retapped the mast-plate, and then also embedded nuts into the fiberglass deck, to which he screwed the new bolts into it. Interesting idea, but I can only imagine trying to get things to line up--while being gummed up with resin. Not to mention you have to drill out your corroded bolts in the first place. If you were to embedd the nuts, I wonder what added strength you'd get--what kind of bond is there on the resin/fiberglass that would hold some 1/2" bolts? Seems like not much. Seems like, the bolts are there just to keep the mast-step from sliding around. So--for now-- I plan to just drill some pilot holes in the new deck, fill with resin, and stick the whole plate, stuck bolts and all, back in place. I think later I may explore the through bolt idea. I just hesitate to try and drill out the bolts. On things not to do: 1) If you're doing the top down repair, consider making your repair area as small as possible. This will keep as much of the outer skin in tact as possible and make your cosmetics that much easier later on. Take the time to tape and mask all surrounding areas. I mean everything near by. I made a mess everywhere. The only thing more messy than resin is 3M5200. If you do make a mess, 60 grit sandpaper on an orbital sander with clean it up, although forget about the gelcoat. However, I would really caution making the repair area too small. While the actual damaged core area on my boat was maybe 8" x 12", I went overboard and cleared an area 2x2'. Way too much. But 8" x12" is also too small. You're trying to strengthen the whole area remember. So route clear into some solid core and establish a broad repair base. 2) For coring material, use that stuff George Dinwiddie recommended, Kleg-cell fiber mat foam from a company called Fiberglass Coatings, Inc 1-813-327-8117, website www.fgci.com . The stuff is not that expensive, and although I didn't use it, I wish I had. I used pieces of oak wood, because I am a cheap bastard and a dumbass. The problem with hard wood is that you have to make the pieces small enough to get the camber of the deck right. Then your mast-step area requires all this work to make it smooth and level and in camber. Thats what I'm working on now. Pain in the butt.My impression of the foam is it can be bent, and then it absorbs the resin making it strong stuff after set-up. 3) This project is fairly complex, so allow enough time. As usual I underestimated the time it would take. I expected it to get done in a few weekends--I am now on my ninth month. It takes time to do it right I think. And you want to consider some kind of covering, like a small awning to allow you to work throughout the day, in light rain, maybe direct sunlight whatever. The weather has been my greatest enemy. 4) To route out the glass and core, use a router with a Carbon steel bit. These are the monster looking router bits at Home Depot, mine are industrial yellow. Don't even waste your time trying to use Black n' Decker regular router bits they'll go dull in the first ten minutes and start smoking. (It took me three standard bits--before I asked someone at Home Depot what the hell my problem was. Spend the money up front and buy the heavy duty flavor.) On another note, don't use a flat bladed screw driver to try and chisel/pry out pieces of glass or core. Use a extra wide wood chisel, please!! I punched a hole through my liner using a screw driver. The chisel was like magic--once I pulled my head out my ass. 5. Don't use just resin and coring material for the repair. You need a filler mixed with the resin to beef it up. Otherwise you'll go through a gallon on resin before you know it. Mix it up with the heaviest filler adhesive you can find. 6. You really need a consensus of information--like from the Maintenance Manual to develop your strategy. If you dont have the articles let me know and I will get you copies of what I have. Hope that helps. As I think of more things, I let you know. Because of my dumb decisions, my pervasive cheapness, and my ridiculous hurry, I am now fixing my mistakes from earlier this year. Namely the cosmetics. PS-let me know your thoughts on the through-bolt idea for the mast plate. Best of luck, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Joe Tokarz Subject: Mast Step Removal Date: Saturday, November 13, 1999 10:07 AM Hi Joe, I tried removing the mast step plate on the deck today. It was held down by 6 screws which came out no problem. However the plate won't budge. How did you get your plate off ? Regards, Guy. Cyrena #466 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:37:24 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: New A30 owner Tom, The hull number means it is # 49, built in '64. I was trying to remember who needed a rudder profile. I took pictures of mine. I'll send with the negative so you can blow it up to size on your wall, and trace an outline. Send me your snail mail address and I'll send it along Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 12:56:05 EST From: Rap1208 at aol.com Subject: Re: Name change? Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. Russ Pfeiffer ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 10:36:29 -0800 From: walshe Subject: Re: Name change? Hi Tom: Just in case you want to hedge your bets as far as offending the gods, there is a ceremony you can undertake as part of the renaming. We did it in September when we renamed our recently purchased A30, Anilavara(Skt for Wind Lover). You'll find a description of the ceremony at the 48 degrees North web site - or search under "Vigor's interdenominational boat denaming ceremony"(sorry, my printout doesn't include the address). Even if you don't believe in this stuff it can be an entertaining event - an excuse for gathering friends and family. Catherine Walshe Anilavara - 175 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:52:27 -0500 From: "Forhan, Thomas" Subject: RE: Name change? It sounds like this boat already has had its share of bad luck. Change the name ASAP! Tom F. > -----Original Message----- > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com [SMTP:THOMASHMCD at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 14, 1999 9:43 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > > From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com > > Hi Lee, > Thanks for the insight, and yes I do want to change the name , but isn't > therre some sort of old sailors myth that changing the name of a vessel > puts > her on a course of destiny that involves sinking? My buddy advised me > that > even so, in this case it is worth the risk! "Kittypoo"? I don't think > so! > > Tom > Undecided, #49 > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 13:58:50 -0600 From: "alberg30" Subject: Re: Name change? Hell yes! Tom: Appease the Gods!! This will tell you how: http://userweb.interactive.net/~alberg30/rname.html Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Name change? > Date: Sunday, November 14, 1999 11:56 AM > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, I've changed the names on four boats with no dire results. Never mind > all that suppersticious stuff, just do it. Pour a drink in the water at > appease the gods if you will, then forgetaboutit. > Russ Pfeiffer > > ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 16:24:19 -0500 From: Bob Johns Subject: Re: Name change? Hi List, That business of name changing is just a foolish superstition. Our boat was named "Pumpkin II" and we changed the name to "Wind Call". (After Carleton Mitchell's book, The Winds Call.) We have owned the boat since 1976 and thoroughly enjoyed it. Nothing unusual has happened in the 23 years we have owned the boat unless you count a few minor events like the boat winding up on the beach in front of the restaurant where we were to celebrate our 25th wedding anniversary, a car accident (see page 93 of the the 1999 Yearbook), and being totaled by hurricane Bob. No damage on the first one, the car was totalled on the second (and the mast, shrouds and chain plates had to be replaced ob the boat), and the boat was rebuilt after the hurricane. There are probably a few more minor things that happened during the years, but I can't think of them now. I hope that this settles once and for all that the business of not renaming a boat is just a silly superstition! Wind Call was never sunk. Cheers, Bob Johns, Wind Call (formerly Pumpkin II), #397 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 11 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 18:30:48 -0500 From: Joyce Sousa Subject: name change When we changed the name on #114 from URANIA (there is no way we could keep that name) to CARINA VELA (which means loosely translated from the Latin: keel-sail), we simply placed a silver dollar under the masthead for luck and had our own little ceremony. I think we have appeased the Gods since we have had excellent luck with her known as Carina Vela. Joyce Sousa #114 Carina Vela ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 12 Date: 14 Nov 99 21:10:21 EST From: Joseph Fleming Subject: Heaving to under sail I hope to sail to Bermuda next year. I would like to know if there is anyone out there who has had any experience heaving to in an A30 under sail in a storm at sea. Boats react differently. I have never had the "pleasure?". Your sail dimensions? Type? Setting? Stability? Other reactions? WE could all learn something. Luck,Joe ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.amexmail.com/?A=1 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ Message: 13 Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 22:20:45 -0800 From: "Andy Vine" Subject: Prop size for Atomic 4 As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ ____________________________________________________________________________ ___ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942709566.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 17:00:52 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:00:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <001701bf2f31$8d7dd440$1d08fea9@andy> Message-ID: <3830ACC4.4553@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Andy Vine wrote: > > From: "Andy Vine" > > As new owners of Anila Vara (#175) we are interested in hearing from others > about the best propellor size and pitch for the Atomic 4. Our current prop > is 11" and gives us about 4.8 knots at 1500rpm in smooth water. (The > mechanic who worked on the motor said we should run at 1400 - 1600rpm.) The > motor is rated at 30HP at around 3500rpm so clearly we are not taking full > advantage of the available power. Would a smaller prop help? > > 13/7 seems to be the ticket. Joel #449 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942714052.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 15 14:15:09 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 17:15:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <383085ED.6D44@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know where I can get the origional oval ports? Or has anyone replaced these with others that will fit the inside dimensions between the two protruding squared castings..I would like to add two just forward of the plexiglass windows to open more air in the cabin.. Thanks Joel (#449 Janus). --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942704109.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Mon Nov 15 17:47:49 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:47:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001bf2fd4$97e988e0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Ross, Welcome to the Alberg 30 list. I think you'll find that you generally want the mast shoe pretty far forward, to move the center of effort forward and reduce weather helm. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942716869.0 From A30240 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 18:11:32 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:11:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com 13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't scientific, just observations. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942718292.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Mon Nov 15 21:36:38 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:36:38 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 In-Reply-To: <0.af08420c.25621754@aol.com> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991115213638.01497a14@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Jim Davis wrote: >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you more >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger diameter. >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on Isa >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had to >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This isn't >scientific, just observations. Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation or turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942730598.0 From Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov Mon Nov 15 18:57:59 1999 From: Thomas.Forhan at mail.house.gov (Forhan, Thomas) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:57:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <6BAA4FF604A4D2119AD10008C7A4EFBB0233656E@hrm06.house.gov> From: "Forhan, Thomas" I too have a 13x7. At about 1500 rpms, we are going hull speed. Any more throttle and the stern just starts to squat. From the hp charts for the atomic 4, it seems like anything more than about 18 hp and it just wasted away digging holes in the water. > -----Original Message----- > From: Robert Kirk [SMTP:kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov] > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 12:37 AM > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 > > From: Robert Kirk > > Jim Davis wrote: > > >13x7 two blade is the stock prop. While a smaller prop will give you > more > >RPM's and more horsepower, you will loose the push from the larger > diameter. > >Quite a few of us have tried different props to get the RPM's up, but it > >seems most have returned to the 13x7. I tried a couple combinations on > Isa > >Lei and for flat water the smaller size worked well. However when I had > to > >power into any sea, the smaller diameter just lacked the push. This > isn't > >scientific, just observations. > > > Jim... That doesn't sound right. If you pour more power into the water it > should push the boat harder/faster. Unless you generate more cavitation > or > turbulence than thrust? Of course, what I don't know about props is vast. > I too, have the 13 X 7 which chugs along nicely behind an Atomic 4. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942721079.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 21:50:20 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 00:50:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Andy, I run at the same rpm, but useing a 13-7 prop. I get 6-6 1/2 k depending on waves.. You don't want to use 'all' 30hp any more than you would use 'all' your cars 200 hp to cruise down the road. Every engine has just so many 'horse power hours". The more you take at any one tine, the quicker your engine wears out. I have been useing this prop for 12 years. Fuel economy will also improve with a bigger, higher pitched prop. I would suggest you don't go over 7" pitch with the A 4, but some desiel engines run a higher pitch. I ran a 12-6 prop on my Ariel, with a 7 hp Vire engine, but that had a 2 to 1 reduction gear. Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942731420.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:00:46 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:00:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] RE: Another New Alberg Owner Message-ID: <0.fb94dfdd.25624d0e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Ross, yes moving the mast on the plate will affect balance and pointing ability. If you will be racing witha PHRF rating, it has to be pretty close to the "J" which is 10 ft, or you will receive a penality. How much the mast is raked, fore and aft, will also change handling just a little. Within the travel of the forward turnbuckle, and the back turnbuckle, you can probably shift the top of the mast back 2-3" at least. If you do this you will have to readujst all of your shrouds also. Some people like one kind of "feel", and some like another. You wil have to try to find what you like best. try to start in the middle to begin with Russ Pfeiffer. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732046.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:02:44 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:02:44 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. Write me. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732164.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Mon Nov 15 22:06:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 01:06:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.53cf0fa1.25624e75@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob Kirk, If you ever played with model airplanes with gas motors, you will remember that a smaller dia , smaller pitch , prop might not even fly the plane, no matter how much "horsepower' it may be useing. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942732405.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 15 23:52:02 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon White) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 07:52:02 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 References: <0.e6b0ff8c.25624a9c@aol.com> Message-ID: <38310D22.1CF87F46@crosslink.net> From: Gordon White Russ: An engine comment: it's harder on most engines to lug them at low RPM that to run faster (assuming you don't let them rev so fast the valves float). I'm not sure about the Atomic 4 - does it have modern insert rod & crank journal bearings? Just as flooring your stick-shift car in high gear at 15 mph strains it more than as though you were in 2nd, lugging the engine in the boat is not good for it. Received the crank and my check is in the mail. Thanks. - Gordon --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942738722.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 05:55:32 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 08:55:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Dick, Sounds like youre making good progress!! New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and crumpled. I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942760532.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 06:24:59 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 09:24:59 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.24a9c476.2562c33b@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Thom, Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only natural that in their inability to control their environment they would develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking Wind'. I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be appreciated!!!! :) Enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly completed. Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had a name all lined up already!!!) --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942762299.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 16 07:14:59 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 10:14:59 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard In-Reply-To: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942765299.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:39:45 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:39:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Mast steps Message-ID: <0.614ce81f.2562e2d1@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi Friends, An esoteric question: Has anyone replaced the mast step with a more tabernacle like fitting? In the gelinas video, he raises the mast himself, but I am afraid that when the mast is still at a , say 30 degree angle, the weight and compression might bend the 'heel' of the mast as it supports the weight of the entire extrusion. Thoughts, comments, commital papers? Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770385.0 From SandersM at aol.com Tue Nov 16 08:37:07 1999 From: SandersM at aol.com (SandersM at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 11:37:07 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.cb5aaee3.2562e233@aol.com> From: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942770227.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 09:33:20 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 12:33:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Back to reefing discussion Message-ID: <0.32ee845c.2562ef60@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hey Bob, We talked about the rolling hitch being the 'knot of choice' for the bitter end of the leach reefing line on the boom, if one didn't want to make holes in the boom for a fairlead or track and car. I found a 'new' book of knots- 'The Complete Book of Knots' by Geoffrey Budworth. Unlike most books I like, this one is still in print!! On page 50 there is a variation of the rolling hitch which looks even more secure for our application. Looks like a great book in general for the knot lover. Wander over to Barnes and Noble or the like, or the library one rainy day to take a look. enjoy, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942773600.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 10:10:04 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:10:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard Message-ID: <0.ca070a37.2562f7fc@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 10:14:29 AM Eastern Standard Time, gdinwiddie at min.net writes: << it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. I'd sleep better. - George >> Thx, George. I know little about welding, and didn't know if older aluminum can be welded safely, ie. metal fatigue, etc.. Either repaired, or replaced, that crack should be seen too, though, Dick. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942775804.0 From dsail at gte.net Tue Nov 16 10:22:28 1999 From: dsail at gte.net (dan walker) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 13:22:28 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc Message-ID: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jlsasha at erols.com Tue Nov 16 14:18:48 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:18:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports References: <0.85238361.25624d84@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831D848.1870@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I have 4 of the original oval ports, in good condition. I replaced all > of mine with Lewmar opening ports, with screens. > Write me. Russ Pfeiffer > > Russ, How do you like the Lewmar's? What sizes did you get and how did thy fit? Joel.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942790728.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:12:22 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:12:22 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich George Dinwiddie wrote: > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the > > spreader socket. > > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can > > lose the whole > > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader > > sockets. George > > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > > I don't know of a particular source, but you could easily > get them made by any marine welder. There are a variety > of spreader setups on the A30's. Ours has tubular spreaders. > The socket is a short piece of stainless pipe welded to > a stainless plate and bolted on the mast. The ones designed > for wooden spreaders generally have two plates welded to > the mounting plate. Check your dimensions; the thickness > of the spreaders seems to vary from boat to boat. > > If it were me, I'd probably just take the cracked socket > to the welder and have them look at it. If they thought > it was basically OK, I'd have them weld the crack closed. > I'd sleep better. > > - George > > George:I guess I'll have one of the aluminum welders at the shipyard where I work grind out that small crack and have it welded up.I don't work aluminum,but the aluminum crew are always working on old crew boat some go back over twenty years.Basically if after you grind out the metal to be welded and there's enough left to weld on then you can make a weld.Lee you like your sawsall, well buddy you'd like working aluminum then you could cut till your hearts content.My mast and spreaders if original equipment,33 yrs.has just a little corrosion near winch area and on very top pad eyes.Going to repaint with two part expoxy primer and epoxy paints.of the type used on offshore crew boats.My spreaders are flat rounded like top side of airplane wing,air foils?Insulation hose over wiring got it.Lee I tried ebay but had no response in my search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942793942.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Tue Nov 16 15:40:49 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 17:40:49 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Jammed main halyard References: <0.8a343046.2562bc54@aol.com> Message-ID: <3831EB81.2CAC@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Dick, > Sounds like youre making good progress!! > New lights for the mast sound like a good idea. Saftey first, as they say. > While the mast is down and you are fiddling with the wiring, might consider > this; head down to Home Depot, or Lowes, or what ever, and pick up 36 feet of > 6' sections of air conditioning hose foam insulation pipes, at about .99 > apeice. Slide these up the mast, over the wires from the bottom to the > spreaders, and down from the top to the spreader. Why? So those damn wires > don't keep you up at night as they slap the inside of the aluminum mast!!!!! > If the wire connections are going to be disconected while you put on new > light fixtures, now is the easy time to do it. > I would be a little more concerned about that crack in the spreader socket. > If that gives in a blow and you lose your spreader, you can lose the whole > rig in a blink of an eye. I would replace both spreader sockets. George > Dinwiddie can probably give you a good source. George? > How are your port and Stbd lights. Mine were funny. They were those > beautiful, heavy bronze Perco fittings, having long lost the chrome finish. > Neither worked. When I went to change the bulbs, I found A) the bulbs were > black on the inside-the superior being himself only knows how old they were, > and B) the bayonet type bulb holders were absolutely caked with salt and had > totaly lost their spring action. The gaskets that were supposed to keep the > water out from under the red and green lenses just fell to the deck, dry and > crumpled. > I cut new gaskets from wet suit material, and bought new perco bulb > holders-perco still makes the right replacement part. When I went to put the > new bulb holders in-they would not work either- the encrusted salt and > corrosion in the bronze fitting had narrowed the inside diameter of the > fitting so much that it would not allow the spring action to push the bulbs > against their contacts! A quick trip to the hardware store, and I bought a > littlle steel bit to ream out the inside of the light fixture, and then all > went well. Needless to say, all the running lights were rewired with Anco 14 > g marine wire when we rewired the cabin. > Bringing these old boats back sure is fun!!!! > More Stories, please!!!!!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > Boudreaux(Boo-drow)wanted a job at wal mart,the store manager ask ,Mr.Boudreaux what type of job are you looking for?Well Boudreaux replied,I want to be the greeter,you know the person who stands by the door and welcomes everyone to the store,because Boudreaux knows everybody.Well the store manager not being from the bayou told mr.Boudreaux o.k we'll give you a try.Well the first person who walks through the doors,Boudreaux directs him to aisle 16,the store manager says Mr.Boudreaux how did you know what that man wanted?Boudreaux says oh I know that man he's a fine carpenter and thats where the tools are.The next person comes through the doors and Boudreaux directs him to aisle 12.Again the store manager ask,how did you know what that man wanted,Boudreaux replied oh that man is a good electrician and thats the aisle for elec. supplies.Well the store manager was impressed,Mr.Boudreaux I've got things to do and it seems like you have things under control,I check back with you later.A short time later a woman enters the store clutching at her stomach,Boudreaux blurts out in front of a store full of people,mini pads,kotex,pms medicines on aisle 4.The woman gave boudreaux a stare like a pair of knives and walked off.A short time later the store manager returns,and tells Boudreaux that he was going to have to let him go.Boudreaux ask why boss?The manager said well Mr.Boudreaux you embarrassed that woman a little while ago,she has diarrhea and was looking for some imodium.Boudreaux a little disturbed held up his hand,thumb and fore finger 1/4 inch apart and said.But boss I only missed it by this much. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942795649.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:11:26 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:11:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Prop size for Atomic 4 Message-ID: <0.368b158f.25634cae@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Good point gbout flooring the gas Gordon. but water slips some, and you don't get quite the same effect. Most modern cars have a 4th or overdrive gear for cruising down the road. I'm not climbing any hills with my boat :) Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942797486.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:22:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:22:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.7b07f038.25634f58@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a note on names. The dumbest one I ever saw was a little powerboat renamed "Born Loser" She was in the marina where I kept my Star boat. Had been out of the water for a couple of years. The new owners were almost ready to launch when I looked at her seams (wood boat) they were badly in need of a little caulk. I pointed this out to the owners. They went out and bought caulk, and worked away. Later I saw the empty tubes, latex house caulk. The boat tried to sink three times at the dock, the only thing preventing it were strong dock lines. They offered me a ride, but I declined. She finally sank out in the lake. So much for stupid names. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942798168.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Tue Nov 16 19:59:48 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:59:48 -0800 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <3831E4D6.28BD@mobiletel.com> References: <000001bf3045$59e32bc0$e133f2cc@abaco> Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19991116195948.015af238@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk Dick Filinich wrote >[...] I tried ebay but had no response in my >search for a winch,does anyone have a source to find these bronze >winches,I think someone mentioned Mich.but can't seem to find it on my >e-mail.Lee I've got another one coming at you. >"High Spirits"#191 Dick > Dick... I would save the looking around because I don't think you need a halyard winch at all. I have a jib winch on the port side of the mast which I never use. It's easy to raise both sails and cleat them without using winches, if you're not fanatic about tension. Don't the racers leave a little slack anyway? There's lots of other chores to do on the boat before you get to looking for extra winches. Cheers, Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942811188.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 16 16:48:22 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 19:48:22 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942799702.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:31:09 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:31:09 -0400 Subject: alberg 30 ports Re: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <3832215E.D964B60A@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Russ ... My Alberg has opening ports in the V-birth. They look just like the ones in the head and the hanging locker from the outside but swing up and latch with removable screens in the V-birth. they are made of cast aluminum. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is > great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings > without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were > (inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about > $200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. > I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone > to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, > so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. > Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? > Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! > Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in > forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! > Click Here > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809469.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 16 19:33:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 23:33:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <383221F0.F1EFC964@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Some time ago I sent out some drawings to a few on this list of the "bowsprit/anchor roller" which was on # 412 when I bought it. In that I was not too familiar with the A-30's I was at first of the opinion that this was a standard item on the model I had purchased. I later realized that this item was installed by one of the previous owners but it fit the boat quite well . I allowed I would reserve comment until I was able to mount my plow anchor and give it a try. well it passed the test and I believe it to be quite functional. I have ask a friend to take a few pictures with his borrowed digital camera and will send to any of those who received the drawings ... or any others who might me interested. Tom S A-30 #412 InCahoots --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942809615.0 From abdullah at hfx.andara.com Wed Nov 17 05:49:54 1999 From: abdullah at hfx.andara.com (Lokman Abdullah) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:49:54 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <199911171249.IAA19596@bug.andara.com> From: "Lokman Abdullah" > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi Thom, > Sailors can be a superstitious lot, their fates and destinies determined by > the vagaries of the seas, and mermaids they meet along the way. It seems only > natural that in their inability to control their environment they would > develop their own explanations of why their lives were as they were. > > Don't sail on a boat named 'Kitty Poo', though. It's almost as bad as the > Bristol 27 I saw once, kept in total dissaray by two slobs, named 'Breaking > Wind'. > > I've read a couple of tongue in cheek articles about rituals involving safe > name changing, that will appease Triton and Aoleus. Basicaly, you remove any > and all traces of the old boat name from the boat-letters on the hull, > paperwork in the cabin, etc. Let the boat sit 'fallow' for 3 months, then > have a big ceremony to rename the boat, and pour champagne, (or Bass Ale, if > that is more dear to your heart) into the sea to appease the god's. Do it,if > it will make you feel better. If I was Triton, I wouldn't want a boat named > Kitty Poo sailing on my ocean, so I think anything you do will be > appreciated!!!! :) > > Enjoy, > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > (f you are wondering where we got our name from, here is the story; > Rona and I, besides being stargazers, loving the constellations, are avid > Star Trek fans. We were watching an episode of Next Generation-the one in > which Picard and Riker find Scotty, who had saved his own life by putting > himself in the transporter beam of his wrecked ship, hoping someone would > find him before the ship's power ran out. Revived, and learning about the > new Enterprise and 100 years of new technology, he obviously became depressed > at lost friends, and lost time, and he had the old Enterprise' bridge > simulated in the holodeck, and got drunk on scotch. Picard joined him, and > as the two reminisced about their early ships and commands, Picard explained > that his first command had been the 'Stargazer'. I knew right then, that my > next boat was to have that name. About a year later, we found #255 at the > Long Island Maritime Museum in Sayville, NY. She had been donated by a > fellow who had bought her with plans to modify her into a singlehanded, blue > water cruiser, and was going to sail the world. Unfortunately, he ran out of > steam and cash, and had to abandon the project, his modifications only partly > completed. > Her name was Aui Quoay, or something like that, which was explained to me > that it was french for 'the dock', and a play on a former owner's wife's > name, Kay. Well, like Kitty Poo, that name had to go!!!! Lucky thing we had > a name all lined up already!!!) > > > Hi Lee, regarding Au Quay, it is French for 'to the dock' or quay(cay). One theory is that it is also the origin of "OK"--French colonial banana plantation setting: if after inspection, the bananas are OK to be shipped off they are marked Au Quay--to the docks for shipping. Lokman Bluenose B183 Alyshka potential A30 owner --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942846594.0 From bzinser at nmu.edu Wed Nov 17 05:23:13 1999 From: bzinser at nmu.edu (Brian Zinser) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 08:23:13 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Ports In-Reply-To: <0.59cdbe4a.25635556@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117082201.00afd2b0@pop.mail.nmu.edu> From: Brian Zinser Russ, my boat has four opening ports in the lower part of the cabin trunk. Two open in the v-berth area, one in the head and one above the closet. Are you talking about putting opeing ports in the salon area? Brian #134 Manana At 07:48 PM 11/16/1999 -0500, you wrote: >From: Rap1208 at aol.com > >Joel, I really like the Lewmars. The additional ventalation is the summer is >great. Size, I'm not sure, but it was one that would fit the openings >without too much opening up. I t can't be smaller. I think mine were >(inside) 5 x 14 or something like that. They are currently running about >$200 each. I put in 4 so they all matched, and I think they look very nice. >I sent someone a photo, and he said he was going to put it out for everyone >to see, but hasen't so far. The screws furnished were metric, and too long, >so it took a couple phone calls to Lewmar before they sent the right screws. >Did some A 30 s come with opening ports? >Russ Pfeiffer > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942844993.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Wed Nov 17 06:43:17 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 09:43:17 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Dan, Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of protecting your bronze. - George -----Original Message----- From: dan walker [mailto:dsail at gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 1:22 PM To: alberg list Subject: [alberg30] zinc to those who gave me their opinions re:gas stoves, thanks. i got the hang of it. i am about to tackle the missing hatch problem. wish me luck. new question, does a boat that has no a/c need sacrificial zincs? i cannot find any on rascal and the prop etc. appear to have no pitting. she was only in fresh water, does that make a dig=fference? thanks dan rascal --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942849797.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Wed Nov 17 07:03:14 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 10:03:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc In-Reply-To: <000501bf310a$167ba860$e133f2cc@abaco> References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of >protecting your bronze. George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch or two. Bob Kirk Isobar #181 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942850994.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 08:27:18 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 11:27:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Name change? Message-ID: <0.ceca20bf.25643166@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/16/99 11:43:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, SandersM at aol.com writes: << om: SandersM at aol.com Lee, greetings. Ever since joining this list, I have admired your boat's name. Now that I know its origins, I like it even more. "Enterprise" would never fit onto an Alberg's transom. "Defiant" might work, though. :-) Sanders McNew WILD ELF (# 297) Oyster Bay, New York >> Hi Sanders, Yes, Defiant would be a great name!!! When I was getting the plates for my '67 mustang, I wanted NCC-1701. Well, in NY state, NCC-1701, followed by A right through Z, was already taken!!!! We are in good company, i guess!! Live long and prosper! Lee --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942856038.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 09:31:46 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:31:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. Thanks. Jay Davenport Revolution, #526 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942859906.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:08:25 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:08:25 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> Message-ID: <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Jay ... here they come! Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Jay Davenport wrote: > From: Jay Davenport > > Tom, > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > Thanks. > Jay Davenport > Revolution, #526 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-001f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 70130 bytes Desc: PictureViewer Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-002f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 67108 bytes Desc: ClarisWorks Document URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-003f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 62146 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-004f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58614 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Mvc-005f.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 58325 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 13:22:46 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:22:46 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! Message-ID: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when I hit the return button! I am very sorry. Tom S --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873766.0 From JayDavenport at compuserve.com Wed Nov 17 15:00:56 1999 From: JayDavenport at compuserve.com (Jay Davenport) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:00:56 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <199911171801_MC2-8D91-53A@compuserve.com> From: Jay Davenport Tom, Great pictures, and a great looking anchoring platform. Can you give me more details? - type of wood, - dimensions, roller mfg. & model #, etc. Thanks. I would like to carry a Max anchor, and that requires a mount which will keep it off the bow, such as yours. Jay --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942879656.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:34:39 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:34:39 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> From: John Birch I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be appreciated. Thanks, John SutherlandT wrote: > Jay ... here they come! > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > Tom, > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > Thanks. > > Jay Davenport > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881679.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 15:37:12 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 18:37:12 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] apologies ! References: <38331C66.5B49D5B8@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38333C27.7D11D30A@idirect.com> From: John Birch Great pics, don't be sorry. Many thanks infact. JB SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > I apologies to the list for that attachment ... it was meant to go to > Jay ! I failed to notice that he had corresponded through the list when > I hit the return button! I am very sorry. > > Tom S > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942881832.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Wed Nov 17 14:31:08 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 17:31:08 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Tom - I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 Quantico, VA --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942877868.0 From phay at netcom.ca Wed Nov 17 17:08:20 1999 From: phay at netcom.ca (Peter Hay) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:08:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> During some of the discussion on props for A4's I noticed that the preferred prop size is an 11". I currently have a 13 x 7 on my Universal 25hp diesel. From what George has said in the past and what I have learned since, that is very much under-pitched because the diesel tranny has a 2 to 1 reduction. I have been told that a 13 x 11 or 13 x 10 would be better. The problem is that with a 13" prop I have only 1/2" at the top and 1" clearance at the bottom. Although the engine runs great I have a distinct "bowling balls in a barrel" sound that only occurs when the engine is in gear. At first I thought it was a motor mount, but I have fixed that problem and checked the alignment--all OK. Is my problem too big a prop causing cavitation or will the problem lessen when revving less with a greater pitch? I am willing to change the prop but not sure what to do. Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 17:55:04 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:55:04 EST Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: <0.cb6780ff.2564b678@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com I've been using the Bob Marshall roller since 91 on Isa Lei with no problems. I have a 22 Delta on it and so far it hasn't wobbled to much. I would suggest adding the largest chock you can fit to it up near the roller. This keeps the rode in place and does not interfere with the anchor or chain. I secure the anchor to the pulpit with a lashing. It should also be noted that this design is for the older boats with the flat (not cast) stem fitting. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890104.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 16:57:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:57:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> Message-ID: <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to the list , I felt pretty stupid. About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing a rub rail on a Pearson 35. Do you have a particular project in mind ? John Birch wrote: > From: John Birch > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > appreciated. > > Thanks, > > John > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > Tom, > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > Thanks. > > > Jay Davenport > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942886677.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 17 18:06:06 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 22:06:06 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller References: Message-ID: <38335EAA.58CD92B7@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Ross ... I assume you saw the pics I accidentally posted to the list (if you missed them I can send them to you) The roller pictured carries a 25# CQR very well and I believe I will be able to also ad a 16 or 22# Bruce if I elect to. It is constructed of Teak. It is a total of 56" long on the long side and 50" on the short (it is offset to enable it to carry two anchors) The width is 9" and it is 1 3/4" thick. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Horton, Ross G. wrote: > From: "Horton, Ross G." > > Tom - > I for one would like any information/photos of a bow roller that > would fit an A-30 and handle a 20/25 lb. plow anchor. The previous owner of > my boat had built a wooden roller out of 1" pine and a keel roller that fit > around the headstay. It was similar to the design by Bob Marshall available > on the Chesapeake Bay Alberg site but was fastened to the boat by only one > bolt attached to the stemhead fitting. It moved so much in a seaway that I > didn't think it safe so I took it off. Has anyone had any experience with > the wooden roller platform designed by Marshall??? Does it really work? > I've thought of modifying it by extending it back over the deck so it could > be through bolted with a large backing plate to help take the load. Any > thoughts would be appreciated. > > Ross Horton > Delphi, #40 > Quantico, VA > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942890766.0 From tristan at one.net Wed Nov 17 13:20:25 1999 From: tristan at one.net (Scott Wallace) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 21:20:25 +0000 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> Message-ID: <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> From: Scott Wallace Can you use zincs on outboards, too? Scott Robert Kirk wrote: > From: Robert Kirk > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > >protecting your bronze. > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > or two. > > Bob Kirk > Isobar #181 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942873625.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:13:39 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:13:39 EST Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch Message-ID: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Bob. and Dick. No, the racers do not leave a little slack. they leave no slack at all. For instance you control jib sail shape with halyard tension, anong other thingsHeres how, less tension, with perhaps just the start of puckers at the hanks, will give you a flat entry. Thats good for flat water, and speed in those conditions. Also it points higher. More tension gives a more rounded lluff, That shape is more vorgiving. It gives you a wider 'groove' in chop, for instance. A racer will adjust job halyard tension to meet various wind conditions. If he wants to win! You may be a lot stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902019.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:27:56 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:27:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Ports Message-ID: <0.8fec8b0a.2564e85c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Brian, No, I just put opening ports in the forward cabin, and head and hanging locker. Mine were fixed when I bought the boat. I guess opening ports were an option. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942902876.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:35:52 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:35:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] zinc References: <000f01bf305f$8b6a7760$39c2153f@daniel> <4.2.0.58.19991117095801.021e17c0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> <38331C13.9C7D8F4A@one.net> Message-ID: <38339037.E9DE4684@idirect.com> From: John Birch For aluminium use a magnesium anode, available at any outboard shop. Zinc is too close to aluminium to protect it, but it is just the ticket to protect other metals. John Scott Wallace wrote: > From: Scott Wallace > > Can you use zincs on outboards, too? > > Scott > > Robert Kirk wrote: > > > From: Robert Kirk > > > > At 09:43 AM 11/17/99 -0500, George Dinwiddie wrote: > > > > >Anytime you have dissimilar metals in a conductive solution, > > >you'll get electrolytic corrosion. Fresh water is not nearly > > >so conductive as salt, so the speed of the corrosion may be > > >slower, but it'll still happen. Zincs are a cheap means of > > >protecting your bronze. > > > > George is right, you do need them. I use one of those teardrop shaped > > zincs that fit on an adapter which screws onto the end of the > > propeller. They are readily available in the boat stores and simplicity to > > replace each year. Each year it comes off corroded enough to show that I > > was right to use one, but not completely corroded away. > > > > I have heard that some configurations don't have enough room between the > > end of the shaft and the rudder to fit them, but they only require an inch > > or two. > > > > Bob Kirk > > Isobar #181 > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942903352.0 From sunstone at idirect.com Wed Nov 17 21:53:57 1999 From: sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:53:57 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller References: <199911171232_MC2-8D80-F9B1@compuserve.com> <3833190A.7E570C06@prodigy.net> <38333B8D.824D4FC2@idirect.com> <38334EBB.1A375089@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 9.9 Fixed & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904437.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 17 21:54:36 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:54:36 EST Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Message-ID: <0.4e0391d4.2564ee9c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Robin, Sounds like that old bugaboo cavation. I run a 13 - 7 prop. At 1400 or 1500 it's just fine, but try 1700 or higher and I get that sound. So I don't do it that high. Pitch is thrust. To power through a nasty chop, you need a lower pitch. For the max speed in flat water, a higher pitch, just like the overdrive in your car. I t will shift to a lower gear (lower pitch) to climb a hill. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942904476.0 From lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA Thu Nov 18 07:39:23 1999 From: lincoln at cc.UManitoba.CA (Bob Lincoln) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 09:39:23 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch In-Reply-To: <00c101bf3161$68d76ac0$0500a8c0@laptop> Message-ID: <000201bf31db$16ccc2a0$73a4b382@UManitoba.CA> I suggest you contact Scott Stewart at Proper Pitch in Delaware. They have a web site and you can contact Scott at stew at shore.intercom.net. The selection of a suitable prop is somewhat an art, but many factors are needed, including displacement, reduction ratio, horsepower, desired speed and shaft rpms. I think that while a 13 inch diameter two-blade is about the largest you can fit into the A30 aperture, the top and bottom clearance are too small to be the optimum. See the tables in Skene or Calder for a start. The props suitable for the Atomic 4 are not recommended for a slower-turning diesel. Bob Lincoln #590 Gimli -----Original Message----- From: Peter Hay [mailto:phay at netcom.ca] Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 1999 7:08 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: [alberg30] Diesel Prop Size/Pitch Has anyone experience with this problem? Peter Hay Rubicon KC384 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From doug.stevens at sympatico.ca Thu Nov 18 08:18:18 1999 From: doug.stevens at sympatico.ca (Doug Stevens) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:18:18 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller In-Reply-To: <38339474.C380F7B0@idirect.com> Message-ID: From: "Doug Stevens" John. What is a half oval? Doug Candy Cane -----Original Message----- From: John Birch [mailto:sunstone at idirect.com] Sent: Thursday, November 18, 1999 12:54 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller From: John Birch Tom; Thank you for your response. Yes I have several projects. One is a fancy teak folding boarding ladder similar to those depicted in "The Finely Fitted Yacht" Matte. The Bronze is to protect the front of the ladder from dingys coming along side. I have a brass half oval on right now but it doesn't look as good against the bronze ladder hardware nor will it wear well when we finally go to salt in our oft put-on-hold cruising plans. As Sir Humphrey is want to say to Jim Hacker in 'Yes Minister,' when asked when a thing would be done, "in the fullness of time Minister" - but I hope the big cruise will be sooner than that! Another project is to protect the teak from the main car block which chews it up on the top with some bronze, and other misc chafing points. I like keeping the Cetol on and in good shape. Again, I appreciate you getting back to me and if you or anyone else finds a source of Bronze half oval or half round please let me know. That is a fine looking bow roller by the way. John SutherlandT wrote: > From: SutherlandT > > John ... First I will thank you for your patience with my sending those pics to > the list , I felt pretty stupid. > > About the Bronze/Brass half oval ... I am not really sure. I did not make this > roller. It was on my boat when I bought it . For the record it seems to be > holding up very well and the boat did come from the coast (north Carolina). The > sprit in my opinion is not only very functional but the plan seems quite simple. > > I did check my Hamilton Marine catalogue and though they list brass for their > oval and half rounds, they do show their round (solid rod) stock in "Silicon > Bronze" They list this in up to 3/4 inch stock. > > I have a friend in NC that I will ask when I see him in the spring but am not > sure if he was able to find bronze or had to go with the brass. He was installing > a rub rail on a Pearson 35. > > Do you have a particular project in mind ? > > John Birch wrote: > > > From: John Birch > > > > I notice your anchor roller has Bronze half oval, would you tell me where you > > got it and if they are still in business? If it is not bronze but brass > > instead, how well has it been holding up against the salt? Real bronze half > > oval has become extremely hard to find, if you have a source it would be > > appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > John > > > > SutherlandT wrote: > > > > > Jay ... here they come! > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > Jay Davenport wrote: > > > > > > > From: Jay Davenport > > > > > > > > Tom, > > > > I would appreciate it if you will email me pictures of your anchor rollor. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jay Davenport > > > > Revolution, #526 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] [Image] > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GET WHAT YOU DESERVE! A NextCard Platinum VISA: Get an APR as low as 2.9 Intro & NO annual fee! Apply online today! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942941898.0 From kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov Thu Nov 18 08:42:07 1999 From: kirk at neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov (Robert Kirk) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 11:42:07 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Halyard winch In-Reply-To: <0.67306cd5.2564e503@aol.com> Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991118113527.021ebcb0@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov> From: Robert Kirk >Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > > You may be a lot >stronger than I am. but try geting that main up after a jiffy reef, in a >strong wind. I need that main halyard winch. Actually, since it's a vertical pull,it doesn't take strength, just mass. This is one of the few cases where I have a marked advantage. I am naturally blessed with an um, er ..., weighty counterbalance. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Got a question about boating? Skiing? Rollerblading? Fishing? Ask a real expert at www.ExpertCentral.com With over 4700 experts, the Web's largest question and answer resource Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942943327.0 From parks24 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 18 18:48:35 1999 From: parks24 at hotmail.com (Thomas Parks) Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:48:35 PST Subject: [alberg30] bowsprit/anchor roller Message-ID: <19991119024835.21012.qmail@hotmail.com> From: "Thomas Parks" Tom, I don't know about everyone else but I enjoyed looking at your bow sprint!! I had designing one in my head for a future project and your's is almost exactly what I was thinking about. I'm glad to see that my vision could be functional. Hope you don't get in hot water with anyone!!! Tom Parks Tradewinds #48 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? 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Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 942979715.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Fri Nov 19 17:46:57 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:46:57 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <3835FD91.2368@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich Here we go another piece of equipment for the boat.At present what I have on my boat is a piece of stainless pipe welded to flanges which is bolted in the inner walls of the cockpit just behind tiller.The main sheet is connected to pipe with a ring that slides along pipe,so when I'm sailing the traveler is always far over stbd or port.I hasn't given any trouble really, except that when tacking this set up slams every time the boom crosses over.I need some imput on what type of proper traveler works well on a-30,model and manuf.and how much can I expect to pay.Do some of you have your travelers mounted on cabin roof?I think I would still keep traveler next to tiller for single handing?Lots of stress on boom with traveler in middle?I'm all ears. "High Spirits"#191 Dick --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943062417.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:47:21 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:47:21 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.b6c0ce7d.25679df9@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Dick, that thing sounds like junk. I can tell you about my traveler, a Shaefer. They come in different sizes. I put mine across the top of the cockpit verticle bulkhead, in front of the lazarette hatch, almost at he edge. A bit of a bother geting the bolts in from the lazarette, but doable. You also need a car, and fiddle block, and some sort of block and tackle system, at least 3 part, (bigger blocks a plus)and a decent size to grab, and of course cleats of some sort to hold the adjustment. There are better units than the Schaefer, like Harken, with balls to run on an all, ( read much more expensive) but this one works. Look in a West Marine, or Boats US cataloge, for examples, or ask for some local advice. I fing that around here, West has a better selection, althought I bought mine, 12 years ago ,at Boat US. There are pictures. Make it full width, from coaming to coaming. I do not suggest a cabin top mount, not with that big main and mainsail, unless you have arms like a gorilla. It will be hard enough to trim it in the center , in strong wind, at the rear position. For most normal sailing the car is centered on the traveler, In heavy winds, let it down to de-power, and cut heeling. The boat points better with it centered, you'll be amazed. Also, in very light winds, move the car all the way to weather, and let the main sheets out til the boom is centered. That take the pull off the leech, and opens up the sail a little, and points better that way. You'll have a few hundred dollars invested, but you' ll wonder how you sailed with out it --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080441.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Fri Nov 19 22:48:09 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 01:48:09 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.26d1477f.25679e29@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Sorry, for got to finish. You're going to have some fine boat when you finish. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943080489.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 20 12:25:57 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 15:25:57 EST Subject: [alberg30] Traveler Message-ID: <0.8b695a2e.25685dd5@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi again, Dick, That sounds like a custom arrangement you have for a main traveler, a design that was on many of the boats I grew up sailing on, which were from the 30's!! For a traveler to be any good at giving you sail shape control, particularly leachcontrol, you have to be able to control where the car is on the traveler. Conceivably, you could change the ring for a nylon sheave that rolls, to decrease friction, and then mount control lines either side; turning blocks at the ends of the traveler, and cam cleats forward to control the traveler lines. If you want to get rid of the SS bar completely, and go to a modern system, Harken sells a complete kit, with all the blocks, cars and track you need. Look in the West Marine Catalogue for prices. All the sailboat hardware manufacturers have their own systems and prices. We hit the Fawcets (in Annapolis) presidents sale a couple of years ago, and got the Harken system for a little over 100 bucks, when it usualy sells for closer to 300. Probably wouldn't have updated the system without that sale!! Stargazer still had the original triangle mainsheet arrangement when we got her, complete down to the original composite blocks and three strand mainsheet!! Having an efficient, friction free main traveler is a pleasure. In light air, by raising the car to windward of center, then centering the boom with the mainsheet, you can get the leach to do whatever you want, when beating. In heavy air, you can play the traveler in the puffs, which is really nice, too. Hope this helps, Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943129557.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sat Nov 20 01:20:49 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:20:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sat Nov 20 22:24:31 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:24:31 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991121052431.AGL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I did what you're probably trying to avoid...I ripped the hell out of the 1/2 inch pad that makes up the mast step. I used a big flat bladed screw driver and poked a hole through the liner--then I discovered that there was such a thing as a wide blade flat wood chisel. I expect that you will have to damage the 1/2 inch pad to some degree to get it off and recore the deck. As we say in New York/New Jersey...forgetaboutit! Rebuild the whole thing from scratch after you repair the core. Scott Murray A30 "Bill Of Rights" has an article about the repair and recreation of the pad. While the 1/2 inch pad may be intact, there's bound to be delamination where the pad joins the deck. This is what you're ultimately going to repair. Try and delicately scrape that thing off. Good luck. It didn't work for me. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- From: Guy Lalonde To: Onelist Alberg30 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Date: Saturday, November 20, 1999 3:20 AM Hello everyone. I'm trying to remove the mast step plate on top of the cabin. The screws came out without any problems. However the plate still won't come off. Trying to pry it off only damages the 1/2 inch high fiberglass mound on which it sits. To those who have already done this, how did you get the plate to come off ? George ? Joe ? Anyone ? Guy. Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943165471.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Sun Nov 21 09:54:51 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 13:54:51 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at the same time. I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots Guy Lalonde wrote: > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > Encoding: quoted-printable --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943206891.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Sun Nov 21 16:12:02 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 19:12:02 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> Message-ID: <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, Tom, Greg, thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: SutherlandT To: Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: SutherlandT > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > the same time. > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > Tom S > A30 #412 > InCahoots > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943229522.0 From jlsasha at erols.com Mon Nov 22 13:49:14 1999 From: jlsasha at erols.com (JANET LEMBO) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:49:14 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Opening Ports Message-ID: <3839BA5A.51D6@erols.com> From: JANET LEMBO Does anyone know the manufacturer of the origional cast aluminum opening ports? I would like to Purchase a couple New/Used and get some new seals. I'm sure this will not be easy to do but who knows.. Joel.. jlsasha at erols.com.. Thanks.. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943307354.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 22 16:01:00 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 18:01:00 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step area. I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already completely glassed over by itself. Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a weather window. What does everyone else think? I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast step)? Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some ideas. Thanks Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and prying > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made of > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even 3/4 > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: SutherlandT > To: > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off pretty > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > the same time. > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > Tom S > > A30 #412 > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943315260.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 01:47:20 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 04:47:20 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very resistant to rot. I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943350440.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 06:45:24 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 09:45:24 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.541b53f6.256bbca8@aol.com> Message-ID: <383AA87F.AE98F667@idirect.com> From: John Birch Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation of A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've only heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was gelcoat, csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, csm, masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I believe was used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is attached to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite eliminate the roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with plywood, I think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, John RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > You know, people say very bad things about glassing over oak. Supposed to be > full of acids that make resins not bond well and, the wood itself is not very > resistant to rot. > I'm not this big expert myself mind you. It's just what I've heard from > people who are. They say mahogonny is much better, or voidless marine ply. > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/22/99 6:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, > alberg30 at interactive.net writes: > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943368324.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Tue Nov 23 06:24:57 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 10:24:57 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <000c01bf3338$88d85f90$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> <38383126.1A1E0C95@prodigy.net> <001901bf347e$33eb5e50$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> Message-ID: <383AA2BB.744294CE@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Guy ... When I removed the plate it appeared to be solid glass. The 6 machine screws which hold the mast plate in position seemed to be set in the glass. I figured this was OK since the standing rigging was not going to let the mast plate go up. It seemed to me that this arrangement was just to prevent the plate from moving around on the cabin top. Due to the fact that there had been enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws were threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the four screws which hold the mast to the plate. My cabin top appeared to be in very good condition. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > ...What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943367097.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:03:04 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:03:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Re: Alberg Molds Found Message-ID: <383AD6D7.ACE7D194@idirect.com> Mark; On behalf of the Great Lakes Alberg Association thank you for your efforts, this is wonderful news. I have forwarded the history of your search to our Senior Board Members and Alberg owners so that your efforts are recognized. You have done us all a great service, and may I wish you all the best. If there is anything I can do to reciprocate, let me know. Again, thank you and fair winds, John Birch, Past Commodore, Great Lakes Alberg Association Subject: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 11:41:57 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: John: Greetings again. I finally spoke with Bill Boyle of Boyle Boatworks and your preliminary hunch that they had the molds has proved to be correct. They have the Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com and fax is 803.733.2984. Hope this helps and good luck. Mark Matthews From: "mmatthews" To: John: I gave them a ring, but haven't heard back yet. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Boyle Boat Works, Alberg Molds, alberg molds continued Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 00:04:36 -0500 From: John Birch To: mmatthews Mark Matthews; Boyle Boat Works, in Columbia SC. Phone: 803-252-8210 address; PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, SC 29250 is the last known address for the Alberg molds. If you have anymore information, I would appreciate it. Thanks again, John Birch Subject: alberg molds continued Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:32:08 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: "sunstone" John: According to a local broker here Whitby molds made it to Ft. Myers Ship and Yacht Building where they turned out Brewer 42 and 44s. Ft Myers Ship and Yacht went broke but you might find some answers at 941.332.7800. Joe was who I was referred to, though he wasn't in at the time and again brokers seem pretty knowledgable in these areas if you can look one up down there. Additionally the broker I talked to here seemed to think that calling Cape Dory might be helpful in tracking down the Alberg molds. Anyway keep us posted and good luck. Mark Matthews SailNet.com Subject: Re: Alberg 30, 37 molds whereabouts Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 09:55:16 -0400 From: "mmatthews" To: CC: > sunstone at idirect.com wrote: >I am wondering if you are, or are related to, the Boyle's of Boyle Boat >Works and whether you know the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 >molds? >Are these molds still available? >If you could forward me to someone who might know these answers, should >you not, it would be appreciated. >Thank you, >John Birch, Past Commodore, Alberg Great Lakes Association John: We are not related to Boyle Boat Works. As to the fate of the Alberg 30 and Alberg 37 molds, Whitby Boat Works of Ajax, Ontario, Canada was the original builder of the Alberg line. While my attempts in tracking down the molds was unsuccessful, you might have luck calling yacht brokers in the Ontario area who may know something of their whereabouts.. There are also a number of Alberg web sites who could perhaps refer you to another source, as well as a number of Alberg boat owners who have left their reviews in our BoatSource section of SailNet: http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2035&ID=924 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=1360 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=760 http://www.sailnet.com/boatcheck/review.cfm?Input=alberg%2037&ID=2428 The following books may also be of interest to you: Best Boats to Build or Buy http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=204&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Understanding Boat Design http://www.sailnet.com/store/merchant.ihtml?pid=771&step=4&USER=-2001653218 Good luck with your search, and if you find the molds and revive the line, I ?m interested. Good luck and Good Sailing. Mark Matthews SailNet.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 23 10:44:29 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:44:29 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Further to Alberg Molds Found; Alberg 30, the Alberg 37, and the Whitby 45 molds. Message-ID: <383AE08C.D00A20A5@idirect.com> Folks; Boyle Boat Works: Address: PO Drawer 50126, Columbia, South Carolina, USA 29250 Bill Boyle's email is wboyle at aol.com Phone: 803-252-8210 and fax is 803.733.2984 John Subject: Re: Alberg Molds Found Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 13:19:05 -0500 From: "mmatthews" To: "John Birch" John: Glad to help. Bill has also fabricated Alberg rudders, hatches, and other parts for the boat. Mark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:19:50 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:19:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com I have one of those old boats and I've been wondering what you guys were talking about with the mast pad problems. Bullet proof is right, my deck is like walking on a sidewalk. The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943427990.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:56:32 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:56:32 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.78e93c6a.256cf430@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Sounds good, John. Nothing like the original materials. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 9:44:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, Sunstone at idirect.com writes: > From: John Birch > > Or Cedar, or masonite. Masonite is what they used in the first generation > of > A-30s and A-37s in the early years and those decks are bullet proof. I've > only > heard of a few cockpit delaminations but none rotted. The Schedule was > gelcoat, > csm, cloth, csm, heavy cloth, csm, cloth, woven roaving, csm, heavy cloth, > csm, > masonite, repeat process again with second layer of masonite (1/4", I > believe was > used), then finish with csm,cloth, heavy cloth csm. Use Epoxy as this is > attached > to cured polyester. In the boundary layers between the two masonite > eliminate the > roaving for, heavy cloth and cloth. > > If you can get a core sample out of an old boat you'll see what I mean, the > roaving is used for the rapid build up of the raised portion or go with > plywood, I > think masonite is more stable, less rot prone though. > > Check the Gibbs and Cox Schedule for glass layup. For my 2 cents worth, > > John --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Stop waiting for web pages to load... eAcceleration has given away millions of copies of Webcelerator. It is the best in its category and its completely FREE!Our website also has lots of other free stuff Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430192.0 From RABBIT649 at aol.com Tue Nov 23 23:59:46 1999 From: RABBIT649 at aol.com (RABBIT649 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 02:59:46 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> From: RABBIT649 at aol.com Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? Paul Ashwagh #23 In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > Due to the fact that there had been > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > were > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did this > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943430386.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 07:35:35 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (SutherlandT) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:35:35 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.8f16dd21.256cf4f2@aol.com> Message-ID: <383C04A7.4BD5249@prodigy.net> From: SutherlandT Hi Paul ... You raise a very good point, and one I too thought about. What I concluded was the following. The Heli-coils are SS the same as the screws being used. Hence it is my thinking that there should not be a problem with the thread becoming one with the aluminum plate, as long as the SS screw remains removable from the SS threads. In fact I can see where this might be the best of both worlds. It certainly should be better than using the SS screw threaded directly into the aluminum. If this all seems a bit confusing to some ... go to a fastener supply house, or a machine shop and ask to look at a "Heli-coil" (this is a brand name but will convey what you are looking for) and then let me know what you think ! I would certainly welcome any thinking on this issue. There could be many applications for this "fix" on our sailboats if it works the way I believe it will. Tom S A30 #412 InCahoots RABBIT649 at aol.com wrote: > From: RABBIT649 at aol.com > > Very creative. I'm just a little concerned about the materials. What are > Heli-coils made of? How does that impact the dissimilar metals issue? > Paul > Ashwagh #23 > > In a message dated 11/23/99 10:22:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, > sutherlandt at prodigy.net writes: > > > Due to the fact that there had been > > enough deterioration in the aluminum threads where the SS machine screws > > were > > threaded through the Alm. plate I elected to replace the threads. I did > this > > with "Heli Coils".I found this to work quite well. I also "Heli Coiled" the > > four screws which hold the mast to the plate. > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943457735.0 From A30240 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 17:17:24 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 20:17:24 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast step, et al with children around ........ Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- GRAB THE GATOR! FREE SOFTWARE DOES ALL THE TYPING FOR YOU! Tired of filling out forms and remembering passwords? Gator fills in forms and passwords with just one click! Comes with $50 in free coupons! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943492644.0 From sutherlandt at prodigy.net Wed Nov 24 19:10:22 1999 From: sutherlandt at prodigy.net (Tom Sutherland) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 23:10:22 -0400 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.2bfafcd1.256de824@aol.com> Message-ID: <383CA76E.8B20F910@prodigy.net> From: Tom Sutherland Jim ...I agree with what you are saying. Thanks for your endorsement of the "Heli-coil" Tom S A30 #412 A30240 at aol.com wrote: > From: A30240 at aol.com > > Having used helicoils on engines, I like them. By the time I replaced my AT4 > it had four or five put in. One thought about using them on the mast step > would be to use never-sieze on the machine screws. The helicoil itself is > larger in diameter than the hole that the machine screw goes through. If it > ever locks up, and you end up "verbally abusing" the helicoil, screws, mast > step, et al with children around ........ > > Jim Davis > Isa Lei > 240 > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943499422.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:20:35 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:20:35 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.dac1385d.256e2f33@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, I've used helicoils before, and I think they wiould work just fine. It they bond with the plate, why, isn't that just what you want, new threads. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943510835.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Wed Nov 24 22:25:13 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 01:25:13 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once Russ Pfeiffer --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943511113.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:43:09 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:43:09 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.97867657.256e3049@aol.com> Message-ID: <000b01bf36d5$a9fb0ec0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Russ, I guess you're talking about the plate that is attached to the bottom end of the mast, the "mast shoe" if you will. The way you do it is a good idea and I've seen it done that way on another A30. However if you have a control line organizer, which is fitted between the mast step and the mast shoe, it could interfere with the removal of that bolt unless you made the organizer with some kind of slot on each side to allow for it. Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 1:25 AM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Just a thought gentlemen, are you pulling the mast with the plate? I just > remove the stainless bolt that holds the mast to the plate. I only have to > locate one bolt hole in the spring, not 4. I tried that once > Russ Pfeiffer > > 943486989.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Wed Nov 24 15:48:20 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:48:20 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991122230123.CNYD2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001b01bf36d6$632eb590$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if it would be adequate for this purpose. Any thoughts on that out there ? Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear to > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > area. > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then lay > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > completely glassed over by itself. > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > weather window. > > What does everyone else think? > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > step)? > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > ideas. > > Thanks > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > prying > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast Step > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > of > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > 3/4 > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > the > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: SutherlandT > > To: > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > pretty > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > the same time. > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > Tom S > > > A30 #412 > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > 943487300.0 From daf at mobiletel.com Thu Nov 25 04:26:58 1999 From: daf at mobiletel.com (Dick Filinich) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 06:26:58 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> From: Dick Filinich This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. Dick Fillinich 943532818.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Thu Nov 25 06:40:49 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 09:40:49 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings References: <383D2B12.1417@mobiletel.com> Message-ID: <383D4A6F.739BD125@idirect.com> Why thank you Dick, ours was delicious last month - eh. John ; ) Dick Filinich wrote: > From: Dick Filinich > > This is to wish everyone on the list a Happy Thanksgiving. > Dick Fillinich -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: C:\DOS\nsmailQG.gif Type: image/gif Size: 186 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:56:14 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:56:14 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2fe0873d.256eb61e@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I do have a control line origanizer, it's under that plate with the oval mast step on it. I removed the whole thing, instaled the 1/2 " thick Aluminum plate, (bent about 45 degrees at the back, drilled with three holes) and bolted the mast step plate back down. Yes it had slots cut in it, for adjustment, just a little bigger than the original plate. All I have to do is pull the stainless bolt, and I never touch the step, or plate. I fooled around a few years with adjustments, but I leave it alone now, about in the middle. I don't have any block on the side of the mast, or front. I use the KISS principal. Russ Pfeiffer 943545374.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:58:01 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:58:01 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3919b689.256eb689@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Guy, I would use layers of masonite, apoxy, class. or bond in a piece of tempered aluminum, that should stay for quite a while. Russ 943545481.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 07:59:18 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 10:59:18 EST Subject: [alberg30] Holliday Greetings Message-ID: <0.b0db5e9c.256eb6d6@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Thsnks, same to you Russ 943545558.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Thu Nov 25 12:58:19 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 14:58:19 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Guy? I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Guy Lalonde > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > From: Guy Lalonde > > Joe, > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the mast > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure if > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > Guy. > Cyrena #466 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: alberg30 > To: > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not appear > to > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the mast-step > > area. > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak hardwood > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working to > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > lay > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill the > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait for a > > weather window. > > > > What does everyone else think? > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. And > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what good > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: mast > > step)? > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me some > > ideas. > > > > Thanks > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > prying > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked my > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > Step > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is made > > of > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe even > > 3/4 > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find under > > the > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of plywood > > ? > > > > > > Guy. > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: SutherlandT > > > To: > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > pretty > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the plate > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help to > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my understanding > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might also > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate at > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush anything. > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > A30 #412 > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943563499.0 From A30240 at aol.com Thu Nov 25 16:33:26 1999 From: A30240 at aol.com (A30240 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:33:26 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.bf1c81ab.256f2f56@aol.com> From: A30240 at aol.com On the masonite, any hardware store. The masonite used on the decks is 1/4 inch PEGBOARD. I guess the reason Whitby used pegboard was so resin would run through the holes and act like rivets. The samples I have seen, and cut from my deck shows that there was an attempt to align the holes. They weren't perfect but it seems that Whitby at least tried. Jim Davis Isa Lei 240 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943576406.0 From lalondegc at videotron.ca Thu Nov 25 04:37:52 1999 From: lalondegc at videotron.ca (Guy Lalonde) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:37:52 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <19991125195852.IATL2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <002901bf3741$e3dee1e0$0100a8c0@videotron.ca> From: Guy Lalonde Joe, masonite can be had in most lumber yards and is available in different thicknesses. Basically those peg boards you put hooks into to hang tools is masonite. My understanding (my 2 cents' worth) is that some grades of masonite have been soaked in some kind of solution and I don't know if fiberglass / resin would adhere well. Test it beforehand. As Russ was saying, if you use plywood get marine grade mahogany plywood. It has less voids, I think it has more layers than an equivalent thickness of regular plywood and the layers are glued with waterproof glue. Or maybe use a solid piece of mahogany. Probably cheaper to buy a plank of solid mahogany (or leftover pieces in a lumber yard) than buying a whole sheet ( 4' x 8' ) or half sheet of masonite or marine plywood. Again: my 2 cents. Cheers, Guy. Cyrena #466 ----- Original Message ----- From: alberg30 To: Sent: Thursday, November 25, 1999 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > From: "alberg30" > > Guy? > > I think I'll forget about the oak. Where do you get masonite?? If I can't > get that easily, I guess I use plywood or maybe someother hardwood. > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > ---------- > > From: Guy Lalonde > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > Date: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 5:48 PM > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > Joe, > > > > instead of oak, I wonder if masonite might be a good material for the > mast > > step. I hear a lot of good thing about it on this list but I'm not sure > if > > it would be adequate for this purpose. > > > > Any thoughts on that out there ? > > > > Guy. > > Cyrena #466 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: alberg30 > > To: > > Sent: Monday, November 22, 1999 7:01 PM > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > > > Guy: I recall that there was some sort old core in the mast-step pad. I > > > think it was balsa or something. I am fairly sure that it was not all > > > glass, since the original holes for the mast-step plate were where the > > > water leaked in and the whole problem started. There also did not > appear > > to > > > be any sort of glass layer between the pad and the deck at the > mast-step > > > area. > > > > > > I have decided to replace the pad with a 1/2 thick piece of oak > hardwood > > > bought at Home Depot. I have not embedded it yet, but have been working > to > > > get the proper camber and ensuring the pad area is level on all four > > > points. I plan to drop a bunch of thickened resin at the pad area, then > > lay > > > the wood pad on then cover it in glass. Mind you the deck is already > > > completely glassed over by itself. > > > > > > Then, after glassing in the pad, I am going to drill little "wells" in > > > which my plate, complete with the seized bolts, will fit. I will fill > the > > > holes with resin and then glass the bottom of the plate to the deck. > > > > > > At least thats my plan. I am still debating it actually while I wait > for a > > > weather window. > > > > > > What does everyone else think? > > > I fell certain I will ruin the plate trying to get the bolts unseized. > And > > > without the bolts actually screwing into anything in the deck, what > good > > > are they but to keep the mast from walking away( see earlier post re: > mast > > > step)? > > > > > > Please, before I make another painful boat blunder, someone give me > some > > > ideas. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Joe #499 > > > "One Less Traveled" > > > ---------- > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > Date: Sunday, November 21, 1999 6:12 PM > > > > > > > > From: Guy Lalonde > > > > > > > > Joe, Tom, Greg, > > > > > > > > thanks for your advice. Finally got the plate off, with patience and > > > prying > > > > it off slo-o-o-o-wly one small area at a time. If that had not worked > my > > > > next step would have been to use heat. There was some kind of bedding > > > > compound underneath which is probably why it was so difficult. > > > > > > > > In the Maintenance Manual, (Scott Maury, "Bill of Rights #487", Mast > > Step > > > > Repair) it is said that the mound on which the mast step sits on is > made > > > of > > > > plywood and glass. Mine is pure glass, somewhere around 1/2, maybe > even > > > 3/4 > > > > inch thick, then the balsa core then the lower glass skin. > > > > > > > > What did you guys, or anybody else who has done this repair, find > under > > > the > > > > mound ? Would it be better to rebuild with or without a piece of > plywood > > > ? > > > > > > > > Guy. > > > > Cyrena #466 > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Sunday, November 21, 1999 12:54 PM > > > > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Remove step plate > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: SutherlandT > > > > > > > > > > Guy ... When I removed my mast step plate I did not meet as much > > > > > resistance as you and joe. When I got the screws removed ( using an > > > > > impact driver, solvent , and patients ) the plate itself came off > > > pretty > > > > > easily. In your case someone before you has likely sealed the > plate > > > > > down with either epoxy or polyurethane. In either event it may help > to > > > > > apply a little "heat" to the plate. I would play a propane torch > > > > > carefully on top of the plate to achieve this. It is my > understanding > > > > > that polyurethane (3M 5200) can be softened with heat. You might > also > > > > > heat a thin bladed putty knife and try and work it under the plate > at > > > > > the same time. > > > > > > > > > > I think the important thing is to be patient and not rush > anything. > > > > > > > > > > Tom S > > > > > A30 #412 > > > > > InCahoots > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guy Lalonde wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Part 1.1 Type: Plain Text (text/plain) > > > > > > Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943533472.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Fri Nov 26 11:51:57 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:51:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate In-Reply-To: <0.b0d12b8e.256ceb96@aol.com> from "Rap1208@aol.com" at Nov 24, 99 02:19:50 am Message-ID: <199911261951.OAA22577@min.net> From: George Dinwiddie > Rap1208 at aol.com said: > > Masonite is heavy. So is water-soaked balsa. - George -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- George Dinwiddie gdinwiddie at min.net The gods do not deduct from man's allotted span those hours spent in sailing. http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Alberg30/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943645917.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 11:00:56 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 14:00:56 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com writes: << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> Hi Russ, Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but durable. and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943729256.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sat Nov 27 12:48:10 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:48:10 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate References: <0.45185e4c.25718468@aol.com> Message-ID: <38404388.5BC4A9A5@idirect.com> Those old boats can't be that much heavier as it doesn't deter from their performance on a race course. Hull #25 won the '93 Great Lakes Championship, in light air to boot. US 17 has been a terror in the Chesapeake. So we should be surprised that a "modern" improvement is in fact the opposite?! How are those America's Cuppers holding up in NZ, any more fall apart today? ; ) John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > In a message dated 11/24/99 2:20:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, Rap1208 at aol.com > writes: > > << The design weight is 9000 but I know my boat > measured 10,000 for a CCA certificate. Masonite is heavy. Russ Pfeiffe >> > > Hi Russ, > Masonite may be heavy, but I thank my lucky stars that 'Stargazer' has it as > her deck core. When we got her, alot of the through the deck fittings' > bedding compound was long gone, and balsa core would have been pulp. The > masonite seems to tolerate getting wet much better. So heavy, yes, but > durable. > and besides, that extra 1000 lbs you measured could be from other sources, > like extra resin and layers of glass in the hull. > Sleep well, knowing you have a bulletproof boat!!!! :) > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sat Nov 27 12:53:51 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:53:51 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.d781e817.25719edf@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Can anyone tell me how the rudder/tiller shaft connects to the rudder? Is there some kind of bearing surface on the front edge of the rudder? (metal?) How long are the bolts? Made of? Is the rudder shaft bronze? Does the front of the rudder have a concave area where it mates the shaft? Should the "pin?" that protrudes up from the bottom grudeon spin? (Etc.) Also, thanks for the pictures Russ! Everything you sent should be very usefull! I am going to fabricate the "modernized" version! Tom Sensei (formerly Kittypoo, ***gag***!), #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943736031.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:45:45 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:45:45 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.2dd2aa22.25720d79@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Very true George, and I haven't noticed any waterloged masonite yet. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764345.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:49:38 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:49:38 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.af58f824.25720e62@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Lee, that's true, of course, I don't worry much, just about that head at the waterline, and forgeting to shut it off after flushing. Another good reason to use the stern-o-matic. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764578.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 20:53:00 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 23:53:00 EST Subject: [alberg30] Remove step plate Message-ID: <0.3e3c49a2.25720f2c@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com John, the only performance los seems to be the longer time it takes the boat to accererate in a puff. Plus side: it is more likely to 'ghost' through the lulls. Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943764780.0 From Rap1208 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 21:03:48 1999 From: Rap1208 at aol.com (Rap1208 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 00:03:48 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> From: Rap1208 at aol.com Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT Russ --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943765428.0 From THOMASHMCD at aol.com Sun Nov 28 07:36:15 1999 From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com (THOMASHMCD at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:36:15 EST Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued Message-ID: <0.64ebf8e3.2572a5ef@aol.com> From: THOMASHMCD at aol.com Russ, It looked from the pics that you sent that you had glassed around the front of the rudder shaft as well? I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" marine plywood laminated together with west system to give me the same 2" thickness as the back of the keel, and then glass over that. My main "unknown" is the hinge (pintle/gudeon) connection between keel and rudder and connection between rudder and shaft. The gudeons attached to keel seem OK. The top one has a hole and the bottom one a pin that spins. Does this sound correct? I was thinking a bronze rod attached to the front of the rudder between the grudeons with pin holes top and bottom. I then could use like plumbers tape (bronze) to wrap around the front edge with bolt going through the front and sides to give lateral strength. I could do the same around the rudder shaft. Does stainless survive underwater well or is bronze better? What about dissimilar metal problems with bronze? Tom Sensei, #49 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943803375.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Sun Nov 28 07:41:47 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 10:41:47 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Rudder project continued References: <0.152a2426.257211b4@aol.com> Message-ID: <38414D39.41A5BAC1@idirect.com> Tom; The Rods should be Bronze, Silicon Bronze, not stainless steel as it will become active when enclosed in the wood and corrode. Stainless should never be denied air as it becomes Active rather than Passive, look to any good table of noble to less noble metals. The bronze should be drilled and tapped into the rudder shaft at 90o, use a jig and drill press as this is critical. A blind hole 3/4 of the way through, tapped the full depth, would be best to prevent the rod from worming through the front of the rudder and jamming against the dead wood. I would add external strapping and to make it hydrodynamically invisible would route the boards 3/16 - 1/4" depending on the silicon bronze strap thickness, fastened with copper, or bronze rivets right through. There should be 3 straps, one at each, rudder post as the post is divided at the propellor cutaway. * 1 strap near the bottom pin but not over top of the drift rods that you have drilled for. * 2nd strap near the intermediate point again not over the drilled rods running into the post. * 3rd just above the aperature but again not over the bronze rods going into the post. Do not over tighten the rods as the rudder will expand when submerged along its width. Use quarter sawn mahogany or better - teak. At our Club we have some teak taken from HMS Victory's Refit in the early 1990s at Portsmouth, from below the waterline, this was pre Trafalgar (1805) teak because the subsequent repairs were in oak. The ship was originally planked in teak, I believe in 1769. The teak was in remarkably good shape but the oak it was attached to was riddled with worm and rot. The teak now forms the base for the Victory Trophy with the blackened worm eaten oak forming the "decorative" upper part of the trophy. It is quite a conversation piece to be sure. Glassing over solid wood is always going to give you grief in the long run, as the wood will expand along its width and crack the glass, letting in more moisture and expanding the crack. Then when hauled the moisture cannot leave and voil?, rot begins. I digress, the point is that using teak and not glassing it over will result in a rudder that will last you the longest, unless you back into something and always lift the boat out of the water by the counter and turn the rudder to make sure you haven't got it trapped by the sling. Contact Wooden Boat for more info. Great project, good luck. John Rap1208 at aol.com wrote: > From: Rap1208 at aol.com > > Tom, good move on the name change! Glad the pictures will be helpfull. I > haven't seen a rudder apart, but one old, neglected example in my yard, had > the wooden pieces drifting apart. It was made of more or less verticle > boards, with what appeared to be long pins connecting them. My Ariel had an > arrangement much like that. I drifted the pins in with a hammer and large > punch, and the boards tightened up. ( I also classed it over) Also might be > very long threaded bronze rods, I'm not sure. but the rudder can be > constructed with mahogony, and glassed over, if you like. Guess you'll have > to inprovise. Long threaded rods, bronze or stainless, brased or welded to > the rudder shaft would work. you have to carefuly drill the boards , then > slide them on. About 3, I would guess, then counter sink slightly at the > trailing edge, and use nuts to tighten. YOU CAN DO IT > > Russ > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alberg30 at interactive.net Sun Nov 28 11:57:55 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 13:57:55 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for the long winter ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in Maryland, I need a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I need to know the max distance between the two support stanchions at the fore end of the bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit while standing on the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion bases that mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the forward two. I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit could be. I have a piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this measurement for me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point out any other obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all cleats, etc. Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943819075.0 From FINNUS505 at aol.com Sun Nov 28 12:23:50 1999 From: FINNUS505 at aol.com (FINNUS505 at aol.com) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:23:50 EST Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? Message-ID: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> From: FINNUS505 at aol.com Hi John, Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" So cool. really. Lee Stargazer #255 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943820630.0 From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 04:48:35 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:48:35 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] anchor roller References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <38427623.1125A46A@crosslink.net> Joe, Since our boat, Brigadoon II, is at the foot of the back yard at her pier, I can make your measurements. I assume you need the "inside diameter," between the forward uprights, not between centers as though you were making a pulpit itself. - Gordon White -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gewhite at crosslink.net Mon Nov 29 06:09:15 1999 From: gewhite at crosslink.net (Gordon E. White) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:09:15 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 References: <943865237.970@onelist.com> Message-ID: <3842890A.6482804B@crosslink.net> From: "Gordon E. White" Dear Joe, Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut a slot in the wood you are putting down. I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and bolted the roller to it. - Gordon White --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943884555.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Mon Nov 29 06:47:15 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:47:15 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <19991129134812.MJNR2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943886835.0 From baileyj at joburg.jlas.org Tue Nov 30 04:56:46 1999 From: baileyj at joburg.jlas.org (John Bailey) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:56:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 Message-ID: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> leave Alberg 30 list -----Original Message----- From: alberg30 [SMTP:alberg30 at interactive.net] Sent: Monday, November 29, 1999 9:47 AM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 From: "alberg30" Gordon, thanks for your help. I assume the bow pulpits from the older boats are the same as the newer ones? Thanks again, Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: Gordon E. White > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: Re: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > Date: Monday, November 29, 1999 8:09 AM > > From: "Gordon E. White" > > Dear Joe, > Measuring off my boat, # 275, so one of the earlier ones, the forward > down-tubes of the bow pulpit are 7 1/2" apart, "inside diameter" and 12" aft of the > bow. There is nothing else that is narrower on the bow of my boat, but there is a > block of teak 2 " high - same as the toe rails - right in the bow to which the > forestay is mounted with a bronze fitting. This fitting is a triangular plate with a > raised bar with holes for attaching the stay. This bar (cast as part of the plate) is > about 1 1/2" high and maybe 10" long running back from the bow. It would definitely > get in the way of a flat piece of lumber laid between the pulpit tubes unless you cut > a slot in the wood you are putting down. > I put an anchor roller to the starboard side of the bar to which the stay is > attached, but it is therefore a much narrower roller. I put a piece of oak down and > bolted the roller to it. > - Gordon White > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3292 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 05:13:04 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 08:13:04 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement In-Reply-To: <19991128185843.LHHN2929.smtp@palberg30> Message-ID: <001601bf3b34$a31d2e40$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" Joe, I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem fitting? - George > -----Original Message----- > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > To: Alberg 30 List > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > From: "alberg30" > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > the long winter > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > Maryland, I need > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > need to know > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > fore end of the > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > while standing on > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > bases that > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > forward two. > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > could be. I have a > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > measurement for > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > out any other > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > cleats, etc. > > Thanks again, > > Joe #499 > "One Less Traveled" > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > ---------------------------- > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > Best Free Games > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > Picturama FREE! > Click Here > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > ---------- > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943967584.0 From gdinwiddie at min.net Tue Nov 30 06:07:48 1999 From: gdinwiddie at min.net (George Dinwiddie) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:07:48 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Leaving the mailing list In-Reply-To: <01BF3B08.77DCCF00@baileyj.internal> Message-ID: <002c01bf3b3c$491ee020$e133f2cc@abaco> From: "George Dinwiddie" John, To leave the list, send an email to alberg30-unsubscribe at ONElist.com - George > -----Original Message----- > From: John Bailey [mailto:baileyj at joburg.jlas.org] > Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:57 AM > To: 'alberg30 at onelist.com' > Subject: RE: [alberg30] Digest Number 453 > > > leave Alberg 30 list > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943970868.0 From alberg30 at interactive.net Tue Nov 30 07:17:17 1999 From: alberg30 at interactive.net (alberg30) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:17:17 -0600 Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement Message-ID: <19991130141820.OTBQ2929.smtp@palberg30> From: "alberg30" George: so after much deliberation here's my plan for the bowsprit. First I particularly like the setup that Tom Sutherland has on his boat. Tom provided me with some detailed measurements and plans from his bowsprit, and I plan to modify them slightly. On newer boats, we have a stem fitting that has fairleads bolted or screwed into the fitting at the bow. The whole thing is one giant metal piece. I tried unsuccessfully this year to unscrew the fairleads. Removing the fairleads would allow the bowsprit to rest against the stem fitting. Unfortunately, I can't get them out. I tried heat, anti-corrosion juice, and even an impact wrench that actually cracked my gelcoat when I whacked the stemplate area. Thus I have opted to leave the fairleads in place. Initial measurements indicate that the bowsprit can be raised approximately 7" off the deck to clear the fairleads. Tom's, I think, is around 2" to 2 1/2". To get me the 7", I plan to use mahogany blocks under the bowsprit bolted through the stem fitting and the deck. I plan to make the total length of the bowsprit 4' at 12" wide. Because the bowpulpit stanchion supports are angled, I think at seven inches off the deck I can fit the entire 12" wide bowsprit. If not I will cut 1/2 circle openings around the stanchion area. I plan to align the board along the center of the boat using cutouts, just like to Tom, to accommodate the shackle for the headsail as well as the turnbuckle fitting for the fore stay. While 7" sounds like a lot, it will allow me to still reach the fairleads if I have to, and will make the whole bowsprit stand out more like a plateform raised above the bow fittings. I may add new fairleads to the bowsprit afterwards. The bowsprit will be this crazy piece of teak that is 12" x 48", its actually 1/2"+ thick. On the underside, it will have two 2"x1"x 48" of mahogany that will run fore and aft on each edge of the main teak piece. This will add support to the teak lengthwise , as I am not sure what 1/2" teak will hold my weight. (I wanted a bowsprit I could stand on, and I'm a big fat bastard.) I am not sure what portion of the board will be bolted to the boat, and what percentage will be overhang, but it will slightly less on the boat side than Tom's plans. On top of the teak board, will be 3/4" wide, 1/4" thick pieces of mahogany that will run the length of the board. These will basically be decorative and add some tread, since the piece of teak has been varnished smooth over the years and looks plain. On the end of the bowsprit, I will attach bow roller(s) similar to Tom's. I may even put a cutout in the end of the bowsprit for a plow or CQR--but I don't have one of those so then again maybe not. My biggest concern, and I'd appreciate all opinions, is aestectically will the 7" be too high, not high enough? I think raising the whole bowsprit like a platform might not look so bad. I don't anticipate any headsail interference. I am currently working on a plywood mockup to get the measurements and cutouts correct. Thanks again; Joe #499 "One Less Traveled" ---------- > From: George Dinwiddie > To: alberg30 at onelist.com > Subject: RE: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > Date: Tuesday, November 30, 1999 7:13 AM > > From: "George Dinwiddie" > > Joe, > > I measure 6" between the bases; 8" between the pipes. > Don't cut the teak based on that measurement, though. > There's a lot of variation from boat to boat. > > What are you doing about the fairleads on the stem > fitting? > > - George > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: alberg30 [mailto:alberg30 at interactive.net] > > Sent: Sunday, November 28, 1999 2:58 PM > > To: Alberg 30 List > > Subject: [alberg30] bow pulpit measurement > > > > > > From: "alberg30" > > > > I am currently working on one of my "at home" projects for > > the long winter > > ahead---building a bowsprit/anchor roller. > > > > Since I am not near my boat, it's about four hours away in > > Maryland, I need > > a measurement from the existing bow pulpit. Specifically, I > > need to know > > the max distance between the two support stanchions at the > > fore end of the > > bow pulpit. Basically, if your looking at the bow pulpit > > while standing on > > the deck, you will see that the bow pulpit has four stanchion > > bases that > > mount it to the deck. I need to know the distance between the > > forward two. > > I am trying to determine what the max width the bowsprit > > could be. I have a > > piece of teak I plan to use ( from the email: What the hell is this > > thing?) that is 12" wide and about 1" thick. > > > > Could someone who is very close to their boat, take this > > measurement for > > me? I would greatly appreciate it. Also feel free to point > > out any other > > obstructions that I missed that might affect the width; I have already > > taken measurements for the fore stay, head sail shackle, all > > cleats, etc. > > > > Thanks again, > > > > Joe #499 > > "One Less Traveled" > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor > > ---------------------------- > > > > ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ > > Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & > > Best Free Games > > Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & > > Picturama FREE! > > Click Here > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------- > > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943975037.0 From rhorton at pwcgov.org Tue Nov 30 06:53:46 1999 From: rhorton at pwcgov.org (Horton, Ross G.) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 09:53:46 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] Bow Roller Message-ID: From: "Horton, Ross G." Joe: I also measured the distance between the two forward bow pulpit supports on Delphi, #40, at about 7 1/2 inches at the height of the stemhead fitting. Ross Horton Delphi, #40 --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943973626.0 From Sunstone at idirect.com Tue Nov 30 09:21:16 1999 From: Sunstone at idirect.com (John Birch) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:21:16 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] teak from the Victory????? References: <0.2761f04c.2572e956@aol.com> Message-ID: <3844078B.786AD8A@idirect.com> Hi Lee, et al; Yes, a member of our club, BSBC, was in Portsmouth on business and he went to visit HMS Victory undergoing a major refit. Beside Her were stacks and piles of old rotten timbers that had been removed and so Ian Thomson, our member, asked the Yard Forman if they where from Victory and what would be done with the scrap. He replied that it is from Victory and it is going to be thrown out and so Ian received permission to take some pieces. A pity he didn't take more, he had a flight to catch, but there it is. The Yard Forman and the Project Director both confirmed the Teak is original and that the Oak was repaired from battle damage from one of two engagements, either in the 1790s or at Cape Trafalgar. I can't remember why they knew but it had something to do with the manner of the repair, its location and the type of oak. Victory was not repaired with teak and so oak indicates, in the planking, a repair and the manner whether it was a whole plank rot replacement or a smaller battle damage repair. This was indeed a smaller repair and in the manner/style typical of late 18th - early 19th Century work. And so was born the BSBC's VICTORY TROPHY, for the best corrected finish in our annual club Regatta (itself a major event, $12 K budget, with a pig roast) - the Trophy remains at the club. Beyond that I know nothing other than you're right, it is very cool and as a student of history it is really quite magical to hold and think about. John FINNUS505 at aol.com wrote: > From: FINNUS505 at aol.com > > Hi John, > Where, how did you get teak from the Victory??? That is soooooo > coool. Talk about a conversation piece. Nelson himself must have touched > it!!! :) Jack Aubrey must have touched it too!! > I saw her in 1986; I think that was just before they started the refit. What > a ship. "A British tar is spirit who's, as free as a mountain bird........" > So cool. really. > Lee > Stargazer #255 > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From JBrouss667 at aol.com Tue Nov 30 11:16:11 1999 From: JBrouss667 at aol.com (JBrouss667 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:16:11 EST Subject: [alberg30] looking for sail ! Message-ID: <0.d78e457f.25757c7b@aol.com> From: JBrouss667 at aol.com I was wondering if anyone has a used 100% or working jib for sale ? please email me. at jbrouss667 at aol.com I also need the old style winch handle for the mainsheet winch. thanks !!!!! --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- ~ FREE Games & CA$H Prizes! ~ $55,000+ Awarded Monthly ~ Welcome to Gamesville.com-- Home of the World's Biggest & Best Free Games Play Three-Eyed Bingo, Quick-Draw Poker, Pop Quiz & Picturama FREE! Click Here ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 943989371.0 From joseph-fleming at usa.net Tue Nov 30 19:32:55 1999 From: joseph-fleming at usa.net (joseph-fleming) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 22:32:55 -0500 Subject: [alberg30] wanted--pix! Message-ID: <01BF3B83.0C31AD40@63.philadelphia-01-02rs.pa.dial-access.att.net> We are all waiting!!!!! -----Original Message----- From: Marianne King-Wilson [SMTP:addvalue at zeuter.com] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 2:43 PM To: alberg30 at onelist.com Subject: Re: [alberg30] wanted--pix! << File: ATT00005.html >> << File: ATT00006.txt >> Season's Greetings! What splendid things I have been able to learn from all of you in the few months I've been enjoying this list. It's been a particular pleasure to see the occasional pix of the boats, too. If it is not against the list rules or the preferences of its members, may I suggest that each person send a jpeg of themselves AND their boat, for a seasonal exchange. As someone who has not been to any events where we might have met, I for one would like to put faces to the names--both people and boats-- and meet you by email. Marianne King-Wilson Windward #369 -- Parry Sound, in the heart of Georgian Bay's 30,000 Islands, the big-water home of championship sailing races. Visit our windy, pristine waters for Sail Parry Sound's Shark Class World Championship August 2000 AND--the bid is in for Toronto Olympic Yachting events in 2008 ++++++ Stressed out? Need a break? Visit this quiet, idyllic retreat at http://www.zeuter.com/~addvalue/ Some openings still available for summer 2000. Book now, for 15% off! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3703 bytes Desc: not available URL: