[Alberg30] Hull to Deck Joint

Roger L. Kingsland rkingsland101 at ksba.com
Fri Oct 17 08:45:29 PDT 2003


James,

I imagine window removal is as difficult as the sealant is hard.   I was
lucky, unlike the bedding compound, the window sealant was flexible.
Windows came out no problem in less than an hour.  I was careful not to
crease frames at the holes.  Perhaps try removing one of the small ones to
see how suborn your sealer is.  I am looking into replacing my plastic with
safety glass.

In addition to the SS bases that will hold the new toe rail, I sealed the
hull to deck joint with 3/16" SS rivets 4" OC (184 total) after breaking 3
rivet guns.  I counter sunk the heads and filled with epoxy so they would
not leak.  I used less than half of the minimum order and would give you a
good deal on the rivets if you are interested in a similar solution.  If you
send your email, I can provide photos.

Roger




Roger L. Kingsland, AIA
Managing Partner
Kingsland Scott Bauer Associates (KSBA)
N40° 27' 49"  W79° 57' 59"
3441 Butler Street
Pittsburgh, PA 15201
www.ksba.com

1(412) 252-1500 X101 - Office & Voice Mail
1(412) 779-5101 - Mobile (no voice mail)
1(412) 252-1510 - Fax


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "James Schueler" <jschueler at familyempowerment.org>
To: "'Alberg 30 public list'" <public-list at alberg30.org>
Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 11:01 AM
Subject: RE: [Alberg30] Coamings


> Roger,
>
> It's nice to hear that you have a heated space to work in; mine is
> outside and in New York, so I only have so long to work on it. I've
> taken almost everything off also but stopped short of the windows. I'd
> like to take them out and replace the plastic but I've heard that the
> frames can give serious problems and that sometimes the same frames
> can't be used. I don't think I want to put myself in that position.
>
> Thanks for the info. To the best of my knowledge I have hull #170.
>
> James
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: public-list-bounces at alberg30.org
> [mailto:public-list-bounces at alberg30.org] On Behalf Of Roger L.
> Kingsland
> Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 10:22 AM
> To: Alberg 30 public list
> Subject: Re: [Alberg30] Coamings
>
> James,
>
> This summer I removed EVERYTHING except the mast step plate from #148
> (windows, hardware, hatches, vents/fillers, toe rail, stanchions,
> dorades).
> I also removed the base of the head dorade and the compass box and
> filled in
> the holes w/ fiberglass.
>
> The combings were not too difficult to take off.  If your bedding
> compound
> is as old as mine, it acts more as filler than glue.  Mine were very
> grainy
> and required much sanding so I will have to deal with installing thinner
> material after I paint.  I will probably shim the outer surface so I
> don't
> have to add material to the wood blocking forward that connects to the
> cabin
> sides.  This might require moving the winch bases, which I also removed,
> slightly inboard.  The resultant gap between the outboard face of the
> combing and the fiberglass will hopefully give me room to install proper
> caulking with a Styrofoam backer rod beneath at the joint between the
> combing and deck.  I plan to shim the gap beneath that joint so the
> lower
> outboard face of the combing will be well ventilated.
>
> I filled all bolt and screw holes (must be 500) with Marine Tex (about
> $200
> worth) so I don't have to fasten all hardware at the same place.  One
> thing
> I discovered; the gel coat has delaminated (half moon, hairline cracks
> about
> 3/8" diameter) in most areas where water got under deck stuff (toe rail,
> stanchion bases, combing, cleats) so removing everything gave me a
> chance to
> fix that problem.
>
> My toe rail was marginal and I am glad I removed it.  In some areas
> forward,
> the vertical thru bolts were bent, probably from minor collisions.  It
> was a
> bear to remove and, after trying to "finesse" it off, I finally resorted
> to
> grinding thru the side of the teak to cut the bolt shafts  (if you do
> this,
> have a spray bottle of water handy to spray each cut).  After 36 years,
> the
> bedding compound provided no adhesion so it was simply a matter of
> lifting
> off the toe rail.  I even got the starboard side off in one piece.
>
> I think the toe rail design is problematic because the rail and the hull
> to
> deck joint share the same fasteners (3/16" SS bolts 6" OC in my case).
> The
> teak is too soft to allow the bolt tension necessary for a good friction
> connection at the hull and deck.  Also, if the rail gets bumped, the
> resultant bolt movement can reduce the strength of the joint and cause
> leaks.  When I replace the toe rail, the hull to deck and toe rail
> fasteners
> will be separate.
>
> The Gurdgon (sp?) Bros. publish a great booklet on fiberglass repair
> that
> describes hardware "bonding" which creates a rigid bond between hardware
> and
> deck by bedding the hardware and fasteners in epoxy.  It seems to make
> allot
> of sense in terms of strength, longevity and water tight integrity.
> West
> Marine sells it for under $4.00.
>
> Good luck with your project.  I figure it will take me three times as
> long
> to put stuff back on as it did to take it off.  Since taking it off only
> took twice as long as I thought it would, I must be six times ahead of
> schedule.  Fortunately, a friend is providing a corner of his heated
> factory
> so I can rub and scrape all winter.
>
> Roger Kingsland
>
>
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 |                This Old Boat by Don Casey                     |
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