[Alberg30] Hull to Deck Joint
James Schueler
jschueler at familyempowerment.org
Fri Oct 17 10:24:08 PDT 2003
Roger,
I don't have to replace the toe rail and the hull to deck joint seems to
be ok. Thanks anyway.
James
-----Original Message-----
From: public-list-bounces at alberg30.org
[mailto:public-list-bounces at alberg30.org] On Behalf Of Roger L.
Kingsland
Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 11:45 AM
To: Alberg 30 public list
Subject: [Alberg30] Hull to Deck Joint
James,
I imagine window removal is as difficult as the sealant is hard. I was
lucky, unlike the bedding compound, the window sealant was flexible.
Windows came out no problem in less than an hour. I was careful not to
crease frames at the holes. Perhaps try removing one of the small ones
to
see how suborn your sealer is. I am looking into replacing my plastic
with
safety glass.
In addition to the SS bases that will hold the new toe rail, I sealed
the
hull to deck joint with 3/16" SS rivets 4" OC (184 total) after breaking
3
rivet guns. I counter sunk the heads and filled with epoxy so they
would
not leak. I used less than half of the minimum order and would give you
a
good deal on the rivets if you are interested in a similar solution. If
you
send your email, I can provide photos.
Roger
Roger L. Kingsland, AIA
Managing Partner
Kingsland Scott Bauer Associates (KSBA)
N40° 27' 49" W79° 57' 59"
3441 Butler Street
Pittsburgh, PA 15201
www.ksba.com
1(412) 252-1500 X101 - Office & Voice Mail
1(412) 779-5101 - Mobile (no voice mail)
1(412) 252-1510 - Fax
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Schueler" <jschueler at familyempowerment.org>
To: "'Alberg 30 public list'" <public-list at alberg30.org>
Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 11:01 AM
Subject: RE: [Alberg30] Coamings
> Roger,
>
> It's nice to hear that you have a heated space to work in; mine is
> outside and in New York, so I only have so long to work on it. I've
> taken almost everything off also but stopped short of the windows. I'd
> like to take them out and replace the plastic but I've heard that the
> frames can give serious problems and that sometimes the same frames
> can't be used. I don't think I want to put myself in that position.
>
> Thanks for the info. To the best of my knowledge I have hull #170.
>
> James
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: public-list-bounces at alberg30.org
> [mailto:public-list-bounces at alberg30.org] On Behalf Of Roger L.
> Kingsland
> Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 10:22 AM
> To: Alberg 30 public list
> Subject: Re: [Alberg30] Coamings
>
> James,
>
> This summer I removed EVERYTHING except the mast step plate from #148
> (windows, hardware, hatches, vents/fillers, toe rail, stanchions,
> dorades).
> I also removed the base of the head dorade and the compass box and
> filled in
> the holes w/ fiberglass.
>
> The combings were not too difficult to take off. If your bedding
> compound
> is as old as mine, it acts more as filler than glue. Mine were very
> grainy
> and required much sanding so I will have to deal with installing
thinner
> material after I paint. I will probably shim the outer surface so I
> don't
> have to add material to the wood blocking forward that connects to the
> cabin
> sides. This might require moving the winch bases, which I also
removed,
> slightly inboard. The resultant gap between the outboard face of the
> combing and the fiberglass will hopefully give me room to install
proper
> caulking with a Styrofoam backer rod beneath at the joint between the
> combing and deck. I plan to shim the gap beneath that joint so the
> lower
> outboard face of the combing will be well ventilated.
>
> I filled all bolt and screw holes (must be 500) with Marine Tex (about
> $200
> worth) so I don't have to fasten all hardware at the same place. One
> thing
> I discovered; the gel coat has delaminated (half moon, hairline cracks
> about
> 3/8" diameter) in most areas where water got under deck stuff (toe
rail,
> stanchion bases, combing, cleats) so removing everything gave me a
> chance to
> fix that problem.
>
> My toe rail was marginal and I am glad I removed it. In some areas
> forward,
> the vertical thru bolts were bent, probably from minor collisions. It
> was a
> bear to remove and, after trying to "finesse" it off, I finally
resorted
> to
> grinding thru the side of the teak to cut the bolt shafts (if you do
> this,
> have a spray bottle of water handy to spray each cut). After 36
years,
> the
> bedding compound provided no adhesion so it was simply a matter of
> lifting
> off the toe rail. I even got the starboard side off in one piece.
>
> I think the toe rail design is problematic because the rail and the
hull
> to
> deck joint share the same fasteners (3/16" SS bolts 6" OC in my case).
> The
> teak is too soft to allow the bolt tension necessary for a good
friction
> connection at the hull and deck. Also, if the rail gets bumped, the
> resultant bolt movement can reduce the strength of the joint and cause
> leaks. When I replace the toe rail, the hull to deck and toe rail
> fasteners
> will be separate.
>
> The Gurdgon (sp?) Bros. publish a great booklet on fiberglass repair
> that
> describes hardware "bonding" which creates a rigid bond between
hardware
> and
> deck by bedding the hardware and fasteners in epoxy. It seems to make
> allot
> of sense in terms of strength, longevity and water tight integrity.
> West
> Marine sells it for under $4.00.
>
> Good luck with your project. I figure it will take me three times as
> long
> to put stuff back on as it did to take it off. Since taking it off
only
> took twice as long as I thought it would, I must be six times ahead of
> schedule. Fortunately, a friend is providing a corner of his heated
> factory
> so I can rub and scrape all winter.
>
> Roger Kingsland
>
>
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