[Public-list] Racing rules

Fri May 7 07:49:54 PDT 2004

Goodness Roger, I am such a fellow.  To imagine that I should have left off
the affectionate portion of the barky's name!

> Gord,
> 
> Ins't that "DEAR ol'Suprise"
> 
> 
> Roger
> 
> Roger L. Kingsland, AIA
> Managing Partner
> Kingsland Scott Bauer Associates (KSBA)
> N40° 27' 49"  W79° 57' 59"
> 3441 Butler Street
> Pittsburgh, PA 15201
> www.ksba.com
> 
> 1(412) 252-1500 X101 - Office & Voice Mail
> 1(412) 779-5101 - Mobile (no voice mail)
> 1(412) 252-1510 - Fax
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Gordon Laco" <mainstay at csolve.net>
> To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all" <public-list at alberg30.org>
> Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 8:34 AM
> Subject: Re: [Public-list] Racing rules
> 
> 
>> Interesting case...
>> 
>> I would say that you were within your rights as windward boat to hold your
>> course if all they did was call for room but not make a move to take it.
>> Even if you sagged down on them a little you are OK if they do not make a
>> move to take their room back.
>> 
>> I was trained to do that in crowded starts...my instructor, an ex-Olympic
>> Finn sailor called it "using your elbows to make room".  He suggested
> making
>> room to weather by calling for it and swooping up under a boat to
> windward;
>> then edge down a little on the boat to leeward - but only until they
> noticed
>> and reacted at which point you crowd the boat to weather again.
>> 
>> This sort of thing only becomes unethical if you press rights (on the boat
>> to leeward) that you don't have by ignoring their rightful attempt to take
>> back room.
>> 
>> The danger is that the boat to leeward can protest (as he did) knowing
> that
>> in the protest court he is the one who walks in with the halo already
>> shining.  I'll bet the swoop to leeward was theatrical to underline hurt
>> feelings.  The "port tack" error you mention underlines that he might be a
>> less experienced sailor and took what he felt was "too close" (10' is a
>> mile) as personal and aggressive.
>> 
>> On another area - we race up here under the "new" IYRU rules that don't
>> automatically disqualify a boat in a protest situation anymore.  Are you
>> familiar with the change a few years ago?  If in doubt you can clear the
>> slate with a 360 before the end of the race.
>> 
>> Our first race is in a couple of weeks - ol'Surprise was brought home to
> the
>> Club from the marina yesterday and our first practice may be Sunday.
> Can't
>> wait.
>> 
>> Gord #426 Surprise
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> This actually happened about 1 boat length below the line because when
> we
>>> headed up, we crossed the starting line at +1 second.
>>> 
>>> This was Sunday a few weeks ago in a Bay high point round the bouys
> race.
>>> Winds were 18-20 and 3 foot waves on the line. At the moment since we
> lost
>>> the protest, we are DSQ. Protest notwithstanding, we actually won the
> race
>>> by several minutes.
>>> 
>>> Their protest centered on their claim that we came down on them instead
> of
>>> remaining on our heading or coming up as requested.
>>> 
>>> We printed out the GPS track showing headings, speed and time of day for
> the
>>> protest committee that showed we never altered course until after their
>>> protest and we were heading up to start (they were bearing away at that
>>> point, then came back up and crossed at the pin end of the line).
>>> 
>>> Their protest form said we were on PORT tack too. They didn't even know
> what
>>> tack they were on.
>>> 
>>> It ended with a QUOTE: "they do this kind of thing on the starting line
> all
>>> of the time and we were fed up".
>>> 
>>> Bill
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> From: Bill Blevins <billblevins at mac.com>
>>>> Reply-To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
> <public-list at alberg30.org>
>>>> Date: Fri, 07 May 2004 07:59:33 -0400
>>>> To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
>>>> Subject: Re: [Public-list] Racing rules
>>>> 
>>>> Not sure. No obstruction, no other boats on the line in front of them.
> We
>>>> both were in the middle of the line and about 2 boat lengths below it
> when
>>>> they bore off. The windward boat was a 36 footer and the leeward boat
> was a
>>>> 28 footer. The leeward boat was in bad air at that time and probably
>>>> couldn't have come up much without the windward boat driving right over
>>>> them.
>>>> 
>>>> (Now you know I was the windward boat. I didn't come up when they
> called for
>>>> room because they still had 10-15 feet. We were on the winches ready to
> come
>>>> up when they started, but they maintained their position. We lost the
>>>> protest at SMSA on Wednesday and are appealing to CBYRA.)
>>>> 
>>>> Bill
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> From: John Birch <Sunstone at cogeco.ca>
>>>>> Reply-To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
> <public-list at alberg30.org>
>>>>> Date: Fri, 07 May 2004 07:52:27 -0400
>>>>> To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Public-list] Racing rules
>>>>> 
>>>>> Data insufficient - Why did the leeward boat bearoff, obstruction, ran
> out
>>>>> the line, other ?
>>>>> 
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Bill Blevins" <billblevins at mac.com>
>>>>> To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all" <public-list at alberg30.org>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 7:44 AM
>>>>> Subject: [Public-list] Racing rules
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> 5 SECONDS TO START: Two boats sail on a starboard close reach are
> running
>>>>>> the starting line. Leeward boat has established overlap. Separation
>>>>> between
>>>>>> boats is 10-15 feet. Windward boat is sailing slightly faster.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 10 SECONDS TO START: Positions are still about the same when the
> leeward
>>>>>> boat calls for room to head up but doesn't alter course, maintaining
>>>>>> position 10-15 feet below the windward boat.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 5 SECONDS TO START: Positions remain about the same with 10-15 feet
>>>>>> separation and leeward boat overlapped with their bow abeam of the
>>>>> windward
>>>>>> boat. Windward boat is protested by the leeward boat for not coming
> up.
>>>>>> Leeward boat bears off dramatically and the windward boat heads up to
> the
>>>>>> starting line and has a clean start.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Valid protest?
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Bill Blevins
>>>>>> Star Directory & Internet director
>>>>>> The Free Lance-Star
>>>>>> 605 William Street
>>>>>> Fredericksburg, VA 22401
>>>>>> 540-295-5359
>>>>>> bblevins at mac.com
>>>>>> http://fredericksburg.com
>>>>>> ###
>>>>>> 
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