[Public-list] Re: Painting the Toerail

[Don Campbell]

Are you sure the white was not white lead?
Don #528

JohnI wrote:

> Gord, No problem. I saw you at the Portland show a year or so ago and
> thought your stuff was great. Traditional is good.
>  After pondering this discussion a bit more, it dawned on me that there are
> some very beautiful classic wooden boats here in Maine that have paint
> covering some very beautiful wood. Herreshoff even painted beautiful wood
> white on the interiors of his boats. So, to somebody's eye, the idea of
> using paint on wood was ok. In many cases the paint was put on by a
> traditional woodern boatbuilder who more than most would be concerned about
> maintaining "traditional good looks" on a boat. So, that's the question I'm
> grappling with now. Why would it be aesthetically "acceptable" to paint the
> topsides, bulwarks, decks, masts, interior, etc. of a beautifully crafted
> wooden boat, but not the toe rail of an Alberg 30?
>   On 9/20/05, Gordon Laco <mainstay at csolve.net> wrote:
> >
> > Hi again -
> >
> > I use Epiphanes too - it is nice to use and seems to last. John, I'm sorry
> > I was so outspoken about the painting thing. I guess if I was totally
> > logical about this stuff I wouldn't be in the traditional end of this
> > business.
> >
> > Stephen - you saw me at the Newport Show and will know what I mean...
> >
> > Gord
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > John,
> > >
> > > We use Epiphanes Gloss on our Alberg and have had excellent results,
> > usually
> > > 10-12 coats provides a nice finish. Also we never sand which removes the
> > > teak leading to replacement. We use a heat gun and a light sanding,
> > between
> > > coats Scotch Brite does a nice job removing the shine for the next coat.
> > >
> > > Good luck.
> > >
> > > Stephen
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: public-list-bounces at alberg30.org
> > > [mailto:public-list-bounces at alberg30.org] On Behalf Of JohnI
> > > Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2005 2:07 PM
> > > To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
> > > Subject: Re: [Public-list] Re: Public-list Digest, Vol 484, Issue 2
> > >
> > > I'm not sure what kind of varnish system the PO used to finish the boat.
> > > What I can say is it looked nice when I bought it last Fall. After 4
> > months
> > > on the water it looks pretty ratty. By contrast, the fiberglass deck
> > next to
> > > it has had nothing done to it in 40 years and it looks almost perfect.
> > > I should add the wood on my boat wasn't all varnished when I bought it.
> > The
> > > PO had previously painted the lids of the cockpit lockers. This Spring
> > while
> > > replacing the hinges, I sanded the lids down and put another coat of
> > paint
> > > on them. I admit to not shedding the slightest tear when putting paint
> > on
> > > that wood, and the paint has held up perfectly. Now, to me that is
> > beautiful
> > > - a sort of beauty in function so to speak.
> > > When making my original post about this, I anticipated the response
> > about
> > > covering up the beauty of the wood, etc. and one side of me completely
> > > agrees with that point. The *real* dilemma was revealed by Stephen and
> > > another who highlighted the classic beauty of the wood and hinted at our
> > > responsibility as temporary custodians of these classic boats to stay
> > true
> > > to the design and the classic beauty inherent in it. As much as I'd like
> > to
> > > just paint the toerails in favor of something more functional, I share
> > this
> > > sense of responsibility, and hence my post to explore the possibilities.
> > But
> > > this responsibility doesn't stop at the toerails and I frequently wonder
> > > where it does end. For example, what about ripping out the beautiful,
> > but
> > > useless, icebox that Whitby put in the boat, or adding an access hatch
> > in
> > > the cockpit that is actually usable, or bolting ugly pieces of aluminum
> > on
> > > the beam under the mast step, changing the winches, adding a spray
> > dodger,
> > > bimini, lifesling, radar, propane bottle, outboard motor, etc. - the
> > list
> > > goes on. Trying to decide what between what's right and what's not when
> > > modifying or "improving" the A30 turns out to be a very difficult and
> > > subjective thing.
> > > At this point, I'm going to consider Gordon and Rachel's idea of
> > > revarnishing everything and perhaps painting over the varnish. That
> > would
> > > protect and preserve the teak for a future A30 owner who might prefer
> > > varnish, and in the meantime provide me with a robust finish that's up
> > to
> > > the cruising program I have planned for the boat.
> > > Thanks everyone for weighing in on this. If anyone has information about
> > > the success or otherwise of painting over varnish, I'd appreciate
> > hearing
> > > about it. I have a few old pieces of teak that I'll experiment with in
> > the
> > > meantime.
> > > John
> > > #284
> > > On 9/20/05, Gordon Laco <mainstay at csolve.net> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> A friend of mine who is a professional boat builder sold a varnished
> > boat
> > >> a
> > >> few years ago to a client who wanted a painted hull...so Ken worked up
> > a
> > >> varnished hull and finished it with paint. That way, he told me, once
> > he
> > >> was able to bring them to reason he could easily 'repair' the damage.
> > He
> > >>
> > >> Gord #426 Surprise
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>> JohnL,
> > >>> I too have thought about painting the toe rail and coamings after
> > using
> > >>> 3 to 4 coats of Certol (the marine vesion). But first I thought I
> > would
> > >> try
> > >>> and use teak oil on the grab rails and companion way drop board
> > guides.
> > >> They
> > >>> both came out really looking good. I'm not sure what your weather is
> > >> like but
> > >>> in Texas the teak oil last about 2 weeks then you must reply. It takes
> > >> about
> > >>> 10 minutes start to finish. Has anyone used Schooner varnish with
> > >> suscess on
> > >>> the toe rails or coamings?
> > >>> Allen
> > >>> A 520
> > >>>
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