[Public-List] Newbee Looking for help with rudder parts

Michael Connolly crufone at comcast.net
Wed Dec 18 07:53:48 PST 2013 


Chris and Jeff, 

To properly install the two piece set, Non-split gudgeon, one has to remove the rudder shoe at the bottom and disengage the tiller fitting so the rudder can be moved down and back from the keel post. The half of the "hinge" which goes on the keel is installed and then the other half slipped onto it, the rudder pushed into place and the rudder end of the hinge reattached to the rudder blade. 

When Whitby changed the design of the rudder, i.e., embedded the pintle into the rudder blade, they also changed the design of the gudgeon. This new design was a two piece, split gudgeon. This design makes everything much easier to maintain and service.  The now three piece pintle/gudgeon set allows the gudgeon to be serviced or replaced without removing the rudder shoe or moving the rudder blade back. 


I believe that there are possibly three different designs for pintle/gudgeon sets used during the Alberg 30 production run. One used on the first boats with wooden rudders, the second for fiberglass rudders built like one would build a wooden rudder and the third style for those who have boats with the pintle embedded into the rudder blade. 

Hope that helps explain the assembly process. 

Michael #133  The second style of rudder 

----- Original Message -----

From: "Chris Martin" <notcmartin at yahoo.com> 
To: fongemie at gmail.com, "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all" <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2013 8:31:03 AM 
Subject: Re: [Public-List] Newbee Looking for help with rudder parts 

I ordered a set from Port Townsend a few years ago, really nice piece. After staring at the parts and trying my best with every tool I could find or make I couldnt figure out how to get the 1 piece unit to fit the boat. So, I cut it in half and bolted everything together. I just couldnt find the room to slide the pieces together without cutting the fitting or the boat and/or rudder. 
  
I've learned the hard way that if anything off the shelf fits these boats I chuckle and feel thankful. Sometimes it works out, but you should expect it might not. :) 
  
Chris 


________________________________ 
From: Jeffrey <fongemie at gmail.com> 
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> 
Sent: Tuesday, December 17, 2013 3:07 PM 
Subject: Re: [Public-List] Newbee Looking for help with rudder parts 


My brain may not be fully firing today, but what's the advantage to 
the split grugeon over a solid one? Installation? 

Gord, I personally don't mind if you interject business into these 
forums. I shouldn't speak for everyone, but I suspect that we all know 
your business, and who you are, to have faith in your opinion.  With 
everything disclosed and in the open, I don't see the conflict being 
different either way. 

I think ~$600 seems expensive for a couple of hinges, bronze or not. 

-Jeff 




Jeffrey Fongemie 

Seagrass 
Alberg 30 #116 
Boothbay Harbor Maine 



On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 2:27 PM, Michael Allgaier <mikeallgaier at me.com> wrote: 
> All, 
> 
> Any idea if the A30 Rudder/assembly is the same on the Alberg 29, which as you probably know was designed based on the 30? 
> 
> Mike 
> 
> Mike Allgaier 
> mikeallgaier at me.com 
> S/V Windsome - Alberg 29 
> 
> 
> On Dec 17, 2013, at 1:34 PM, Glenn <brooks.glenn at comcast.net> wrote: 
> 
>> Hello all, 
>> 
>> I just called Port Townsend Foundry.  Interestingly they have had several inquiries over the last few days. They think they do have molds for the split grudgeon for the fiberglass rudders in stock.  However they mentioned supplying two or three A30's in previous years and there may be several different designs.  I will send them the link to the photo on the a30 web site and will advise if this appears the same as the foundry mold. 
>> 
>> A price estimate for the split grudgeon is between $250 and $350 -which seems reasonable. They also machine the bearing surface to match individual boat measurements from back of the hull to center of the rudder shaft. 
>> 
>> Unless we come up with something cheaper from edson i will most likely place an order in the next week or so.  Others are welcome to join, they say the price will be the same as the casting is mostly a time and materials charge. 
>> 
>> Cheers 
>> Glenn Brooks 
>> Dolce 318 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad 
>> 
>> On Dec 15, 2013, at 10:19 AM, Glenn <brooks.glenn at comcast.net> wrote: 
>> 
>>> I can call and ask early next week.  I visited them spring 2012 when I was thinking of adding a new stem head fitting.  I am pretty sure they do not have A 30 patterns made up, but could take them my pintel to copy.  They make their own patterns and do good casting work, its just very expensive these days to cast in bronze.  Will advise what they quote for price if we have 3 or 4 sets  that could be made up in a batch. 
>>> 
>>> Gpb 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad 
>>> 
>>> On Dec 15, 2013, at 8:47 AM, Michael Connolly <crufone at comcast.net> wrote: 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Glenn and Woody, 
>>>> 
>>>> I would be interested in what the specs are for what Port Townsend Foundry has made in the past for the Alberg 30.  I heard that what patterns they have are for the Pacific Seacraft Dana 24 or 26. Someone on this list purchased these parts from Pt. Townsend and had to substantially modify them to fit his Alberg 30. Because of the initial high cost plus not knowing that they would not easily fit the Alberg 30 he was not a happy camper.  When you guys are doing your research with Pt. Townsend it would be good to learn if they have come up with patterns for the Alberg 30  specifically. 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Michael #133 
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> 
>>>> From: "Glenn" <brooks.glenn at comcast.net> 
>>>> To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all" <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> 
>>>> Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2013 11:27:22 AM 
>>>> Subject: Re: [Public-List] Newbee Looking for help with rudder parts 
>>>> 
>>>> Hi Woody,  Did Pt Townsend Foundry quote you a price? 
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks 
>>>> Glenn 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPad 
>>>> 
>>>> On Dec 13, 2013, at 9:33 AM, Bill Woodford <williamwoodford at charleswoodford.com> wrote: 
>>>> 
>>>>> Brad, 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I am in the market myself.  I have been in contact with Port Townsend 
>>>>> Foundry who advises they have made these parts for the A30 before and are 
>>>>> able to make the gudgeon and pintle.  The contact info is: 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Peter R. Langley 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Port Townsend Foundry LLC 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 251 Otto St. 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Port Townsend WA. 98368 
>>>>> 
>>>>> P. 360 385-6425 
>>>>> 
>>>>> F. 360 385-1947 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Best regards, 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Woody 
>>>>> 
>>>>> US 11 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> FYI, 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I searched the A30 archives and came across New Found Metals as a possible 
>>>>> source.  Upon contacting them, they advised they do not make the 
>>>>> gudgeon/pintles 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Fri, Dec 13, 2013 at 12:01 PM, Michael Connolly <crufone at comcast.net>wrote: 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hello all, 
>>>>>> Brad sent me this E-mail and I asked George if I should pass it on. He 
>>>>>> said yes so here it is. 
>>>>>> Michael #133 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> From: "Bradford Cooke" < brad at bradfordcookelaw.com > 
>>>>>> To: crufone at comcast.net 
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 2:26:50 PM 
>>>>>> Subject: Alberg #109 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi Michael Connelly, 
>>>>>> I just joined your public list for Alberg 30 owners.  I wonder if my 
>>>>>> situation comes under your rules for publication. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 11/25, my boat's mooring lines broke in a storm.  She wound up on the 
>>>>>> rocks, sustaining damage to the rudder.  Basically, the gudgeons and 
>>>>>> pintles broke.  If hinges is a better term, then the straps to the keep 
>>>>>> snapped. Also, a metal cap (keeping the rudder in place) on the bottom of 
>>>>>> the keel was ripped off Do you, or anyone, know where I might get 
>>>>>> replacements, or who could make new ones?  Then there is the process of 
>>>>>> installing them.  Any help you ould give would be greatly appreciated. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Thank you, 
>>>>>> Brad Cooke 
>>>>>> 646-763-0156 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ 
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>>>>> _______________________________________________ 
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> 
> 
> 
> Mike Allgaier 
> mikeallgaier at me.com 
> S/V Windsome - Alberg 29 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> These businesses support your Association: 
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> Please support them. 
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-- 
______________ 

Jeffrey Fongemie 

_______________________________________________ 
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Please support them. 
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_______________________________________________ 
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Please support them. 
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