[Public-List] Public-List Digest, Vol 3273, Issue 2

Gordon Laco via Public-List public-list at lists.alberg30.org
Sun Jun 5 19:27:44 PDT 2016 

Hello Rod - 

It gets weirder... There¹s a funny Œbump¹ on the forward face of each blade
just aft of the rounded leading edge.  I¹ll send you a diagram from
Practical Sailor.

By the way, do you still need to borrow my nicropress tool? Did you get your
boat in the water and over to Midland Point?  I¹m home from my crazy
business travel finally (for a while)

Gord


On 2016-06-05, 10:23 PM, "Rod" <weatherhelm at hotmail.com> wrote:

> Smaller diameter 
> Narrower blades
> Thicker cross section
> 
> These all sound counterintuitive
> How can it possibly work BETTER ?
> There must be snake oil here somewhere.   I must get one of those magic props
> (-: 
> 
> 
> Cheers,  Rod 
> 
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Gordon Laco via Public-List
> Date:05-06-2016  9:05 PM  (GMT-05:00)
> To: charles pleisse , Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all ,
> public-list-request at lists.alberg30.org
> Subject: Re: [Public-List] Public-List Digest, Vol 3273, Issue 2
> 
> Hello friends,
> 
> Found it already.  The old prop, factory installed at Whitby Boatworks, is a
> two blade 'Columbian' 13 diameter x 7 pitch.
> 
> The new Campbell prop is 11 x 5.
> 
> As I wrote below, the Campbell prop is very different.  The blades are thick
> in cross section with rounded somewhat blunt leading edges, not sharp.  Each
> blade is quite a bit narrower than each of the old two blade prop's blades.
> The aggregate result is that although there are three blades, there's only
> something like 20% more area than the traditional two bladed prop.
> 
> My understanding of the quietness is that there is never a time when more
> than one third of the area of the prop is masked by the sternpost... So I'm
> not getting that 'whomph' caused by BOTH blades being masked, all the area,
> twice every rotation.
> 
> I'll send a picture of the new prop if people write me off line.
> 
> Gord Surprise 426
> 
> 
> On 2016-06-05, 8:28 PM, "charles pleisse via Public-List"
> <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
> 
>> > Gord,
>> > Was your new Campbell prop a 2 or 3 blade prop?
>> > Charlie
>> > Sookie 221
>> > 
>> > Jun 5, 2016 at 3:05 PM, via Public-List <public-list at lists.alberg30.org>
>> > wrote:
>> > 
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>>> >> 
>>> >> Today's Topics:
>>> >> 
>>> >>    1. Re: Propellers... (Gordon Laco via Public-List)
>>> >> 
>>> >> 
>>> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >> 
>>> >> Message: 1
>>> >> Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2016 14:12:52 -0400
>>> >> From: Gordon Laco via Public-List <public-list at lists.alberg30.org>
>>> >> To: Don Campbell <dk.campbell at xplornet.ca>
>>> >> Cc: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
>>> >>         <public-list at lists.alberg30.org>
>>> >> Subject: Re: [Public-List] Propellers...
>>> >> Message-ID: <7CF3D811-D6FB-4664-8C6F-F8423E87C99C at csolve.net>
>>> >> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset=utf-8
>>> >> 
>>> >> Hi Don
>>> >> 
>>> >> It's 3x as per Campbell standard for our boats.  Pitch and diameter are
>>> >> also as per their advertised standard made for our boats, engines and
>>> >> transmission ratio
>>> >> 
>>> >> G
>>> >> 
>>> >> On 2016-06-05, at 2:01 PM, "Don Campbell" <dk.campbell at xplornet.ca>
>>> wrote:
>>> >> 
>>>> >>> The only things you have not given us is the diameter and pitch of this
>>> >> new machine! I am guessing a two blade because of your comment on the
>>> stock
>>> >> blade from Whitby B.W. but not sure on that either.
>>>> >>> Don Campbell
>>>> >>> 
>>>> >>> -----Original Message----- From: Gordon Laco via Public-List
>>>> >>> Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2016 11:44 AM
>>>> >>> To: George Dinwiddie ; Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [Public-List] Propellers...
>>>> >>> 
>>>> >>> Thanks,
>>>> >>> 
>>>> >>> Caroline laughed at me over the battery charger/charge state thing.
>>> >> When I
>>>> >>> noticed it had clicked off, I assumed a malfunction so went into
>>>> 'grumpy
>>>> >>> Gord' mode.... 'damned thing, what next, knew something would go wrong,
>>> >> hate
>>>> >>> batteries, when I am going to find time to fix this, probably five
>>>> things
>>>> >>> wrong, not just one...' etc etc  until I realized that the issue was
>>>> that
>>>> >>> the batteries were indeed fully charged...
>>>> >>> 
>>>> >>> 
>>>> >>> On 2016-06-05, 11:11 AM, "George Dinwiddie via Public-List"
>>>> >>> <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
>>>> >>> 
>>>>> >>>> Sounds like a complete win, Gord.
>>>>> >>>> 
>>>>> >>>> On 6/5/16 10:42 AM, Gordon Laco via Public-List wrote:
>>>>>> >>>>> Hello friends,
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> I?m sorry to reintroduce this topic... But I?ve changed propellers
and
>>>>>> >>>>> thought I?d share the experience.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> Some of you may recall that I have pontificated about taking a
>>>>>> ?don?t
>>>>>> >>>>> change? position with regard to the prop supplied by Whitby
>>>>>> Boatworks
>>> >> with
>>>>>> >>>>> the Atomic IV engines many of our boats have.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> Well this spring I was thinking about the engine and decided to try
a
>>>>>> >>>>> change.  Last fall?s ?Misery Trip? reached a crescendo of suffering
>>> >> with a
>>>>>> >>>>> slog to windward in 40 knot winds and a sharp chop...  We were
>>>>>> nearly
>>>>>> >>>>> stopped a few times, mostly by wave action, but SURPRISE trudged
along
>>> >> and I
>>>>>> >>>>> would say coped better than our companion?s boats which were all
fin
>>> >> keeled
>>>>>> >>>>> yachts fitted with diesels.    So power delivered to the water
>>>>>> wasn?t
>>> >> the
>>>>>> >>>>> issue... What I was thinking about was alternator performance and
>>> >> cooling.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> Cooling has never been an issue with our engine, particularly since
I
>>>>>> >>>>> replaced the old water pump with the upgrade offered by Moyer.
>>> >> However I?ve
>>>>>> >>>>> been keenly aware that our cruising RPM of about 1000 doesn?t
>>>>>> really
>>> >> spin
>>>>>> >>>>> things down in the engine compartment fast enough to deliver what
the
>>>>>> >>>>> alternator is theoretically capable of.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> I liked the look of the narrowed bladed ?Campbell? props I?d seen
on
>>> >> other
>>>>>> >>>>> boats, and liked the idea of increasing revs while at least keeping
>>> >> the same
>>>>>> >>>>> ?power in the water? situation the stock two bladed prop gave us.
So I
>>>>>> >>>>> ordered the Campbell which they recommend for Alberg 30?s fitted
with
>>> >> Atomic
>>>>>> >>>>> IV engines with 1:1 transmissions.    The vendor said he was >>>>>>
certain
>>> >> what
>>>>>> >>>>> shaft diameter and taper my boat has... But because I?m a doubter,
I
>>> >> sent
>>>>>> >>>>> him my old prop for reference.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> In due course the new prop came back along with the old one (and he
was
>>>>>> >>>>> right, he did already know the specs).  I couldn?t wait to try it
out.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> We installed the new prop as part of my condensed spring outfitting
>>> >> (and no,
>>>>>> >>>>> I did not do the cap rail job I wrote about earlier.  I got busy
with
>>> >> work
>>>>>> >>>>> which took me away most of April and May so that?s that on that job
for
>>>>>> >>>>> now).  Eagle eyed Rod saw the shiny new thing and commented ?I
>>>>>> thought
>>> >> you
>>>>>> >>>>> said...?     Well I know what I said, but what the heck...
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> We got SURPRISE into the water and after securing the rig, started
up
>>> >> and
>>>>>> >>>>> started the two hour trip back to our sailing club.  First thing I
>>> >> noticed
>>>>>> >>>>> was that I seemed to have a lot more power in reverse than before.
The
>>>>>> >>>>> second thing was that prop walk seemed to have dissappeared...
>>>>>> Amazing.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> The only negative comment I?d read about these props on line
>>>>>> referred
>>> >> to a
>>>>>> >>>>> supposed loss of maneuvring power... But I was able to do the usual
>>> >> spin
>>>>>> >>>>> within her length that SURPRISE normally does.    Motoring out of
>>>>>> >>>>> Dutchman?s Cove Marina, I found that our speed at idle was lower,
and
>>> >> that?s
>>>>>> >>>>> a good thing of course not unexpected because of the finer pitch.
>>> >> Once out
>>>>>> >>>>> past the breakwater, we opened the throttle and both Caroline and I
>>> >> were
>>>>>> >>>>> amazed.  Boat speed climbed to 6.6 knots as usual for full
>>>>>> throttle,
>>> >> but
>>>>>> >>>>> there was no roar and vibration from the engine.  I won?t say it
>>>>>> was as
>>>>>> >>>>> quiet as electric, but the change from how things were was
>>>>>> startling
>>> >> and
>>>>>> >>>>> dramatic.   We were so quiet at full speed I mistrusted the
>>>>>> knotmeter
>>> >> and
>>>>>> >>>>> fired up the GPS, but it confirmed the speed.  Amazing.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> We found our old cruising speed of 5.2 at 1000rpm was now 5.2 at
1400
>>> >> (this
>>>>>> >>>>> second RPM was full out open throttle with the old prop). Yes the
>>> >> engine was
>>>>>> >>>>> spinning faster, but at the same throttle setting and clearly not
>>> >> labouring
>>>>>> >>>>> quite so hard.   The boat was so quiet we didn?t feel like we were
>>> >> moving,
>>>>>> >>>>> so we did the trip at 6+.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> So the prop change is rated a total success.  But there was a
>>>>>> surprise
>>> >> in
>>>>>> >>>>> store for us.  Because I was away so much I didn?t do my usual
>>>>>> thorough
>>>>>> >>>>> recharge of the batteries... We started up after launch on what was
>>> >> left in
>>>>>> >>>>> the batteries after the Misery Trip and months of winter lay up.
I
>>> >> was
>>>>>> >>>>> glad there seemed to be enough juice to spin the engine.
>>>>>> >>>>> Yesterday I decided to connect up the battery charger and run it
all
>>> >> day...
>>>>>> >>>>> But after only moments, the charger was indicating full charge.  I
>>> >> assumed a
>>>>>> >>>>> problem with the charger but after investigating, realized that the
>>>>>> >>>>> ?problem? was that the battery bank was indeed fully charged and
the
>>>>>> >>>>> automatic function on the charger was sensing this and shutting
off.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> How could that be, I thought... Then it occurred to me that the
>>> >> alternator
>>>>>> >>>>> must have run up the batteries on the trip over from the marina.
In
>>> >> the old
>>>>>> >>>>> days, the alternator barely kept up with the engine?s requirements
and
>>> >> I?d
>>>>>> >>>>> had to charge from shore power periodically.  So it appears that
>>> >> whatever
>>>>>> >>>>> was in the batteries at launch, the engine itself topped them up in
>>> >> the 90
>>>>>> >>>>> minute shot over under power (wasn?t two hours because we galloped
home
>>>>>> >>>>> faster).
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> Happy happy.
>>>>>> >>>>> 
>>>>>> >>>>> Gord #426 Surprise
>>>> >>> 
>>>> >>> 
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>>> >> End of Public-List Digest, Vol 3273, Issue 2
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