[Alberg30] Exhaust Pipe
John Birch
Sunstone at idirect.com
Thu May 31 21:48:42 PDT 2001
There is a pipe that is larger than the hot exhaust pipe entering from the
bottom that is attached to the top so that it prevents water from entering
the top of the hot pipe and forces the exhaust back down into the water were
they mix and exit at the side.
I really don't think these units seem to have a planned obsolesce - hence
they would never survive the in automotive muffler trade ; )
No I haven't taken it apart, but a little research and thinking on it and
you will come to a similar conclusion - let me know it your research comes
up with a different conclusion. I spoke to Kurt Hansen about it years ago
but I no longer remember how or why he came up with the system - but it
works.
I can't really add more than that. Hope it was a help.
Cheers,
John
----- Original Message -----
From: Brian and Elaine Timmins <timmins at optonline.net>
To: <public-list at alberg30.org>
Cc: <Sunstone at iditect.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 31, 2001 5:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Alberg30] Exhaust Pipe
> John,
> Did you actually have your standpipe apart? What I'm trying to figure
out
> is: How does the water which is injected into the standpipe in the middle
of
> the top avoid going straight into the exhaust pipe which enters the
> standpipe in the center of the bottom and extends "nearly all the way to
the
> top". I find it hard to beleive that in such an elegantly designed exhaust
> system that the air pressure of the exhaust gas is all that is keeping the
> water from running straight into the dry side of the manifold and straight
> into cylinder #4. If this is the case, why haven't all Whitby installed
> engines drowned in their own cooling water the first time they don't start
> immediately?
> Mine appears to be in great shape, but I'm planning for the future,
just
> in case.
> Regards, Brian #497
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Birch" <Sunstone at idirect.com>
> To: <public-list at alberg30.org>
> Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 10:55 AM
> Subject: Re: [Alberg30] Exhaust Pipe
>
>
> > Yes Whitby built these mufflers and installed them on their A-37's too.
> Our
> > A-37 Sunstone, KC 65, has a Westerbeke 4-107 and uses such an exhaust
> > identical to the one that was on our A-30 Wind Rose, KC 544. I would not
> be
> > surprised if Whitby also put them on the Whitby 42 and 45s either. It is
> an
> > elegant yet simple design, the centre hot exhaust pipe goes nearly to
the
> > top inside and the water and exhaust mix and exit about 70% of the
> distance
> > to the top out the side of the muffler water jacket leaving all the down
> > stream piping fairly cool. They are not welded together but soldered,
and
> if
> > you ever remover the pipe to change the iron exhaust flange at the
> Manifold
> > do be careful not to apply any twisting motion to the internal bronze
pipe
> > which comes off the iron elbow near the manifold flange or you will
sheer
> > the solder on the pipe where it enters the water jacket.
> >
> > The jacket and pipe are, I believe, bronze and not copper and when I
> sheered
> > the solder seal ( on Wind Rose's muffler ) and took it to a machine
shop,
> > the first thing the machinist said was "wow, that is worth a bundle,
don't
> > ever think of replacing it because it is bronze" - he put a torch on it
> and
> > resoldered the pipe at the base to the water jacket and it was perfect.
> >
> > When using a pipe wrench to remove or install, do be careful to pad the
> > teeth so they do not chew up the bronze pipe (it is fairly soft and will
> > mark or deform easily). If the exhaust iron elbow has failed it is often
> > prudent to take it to a shop to get the iron flange off the bronze pipe
> but
> > REMEMBER the thing is soldered together and too much heat applied will
> melt
> > the solder. SO DO POINT THAT FACT (THAT IT IS SOLDERED) OUT TO THE
> > MACHINIST.
> >
> > It is such a pain to get the whole thing back together and then find it
is
> > leaking - been there, done that ; )
> >
> > On Iron elbows - do remember to use a black iron elbow and not a
> galvanised
> > one as toxic fumes are released from the galvanising with the heat of
the
> > engine. The elbow is not cooled in the system and gets quite hot which
is
> > why the water hose runs up to the Muffler jacket. Many elbows are
wrapped
> in
> > asbestos tape too - yea asbestos, yea that kind of asbestos - so please
do
> > take appropriate precautions handling it.
> >
> > Hope this is a help.
> >
> > Fair winds,
> >
> > John Birch
> > 9 Homewood Avenue
> > Hamilton, Ontario, Canada
> > L8P 2M1
> >
> > Tel: (905) 521-9166
> > E-Mail: Sunstone at idirect.com
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Brian and Elaine Timmins <timmins at optonline.net>
> > To: <public-list at alberg30.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2001 7:58 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Alberg30] Exhaust Pipe
> >
> >
> > > Since we're briefly touching the topic, was Whitby's exhaust the
> > > bronze/copper standpipe design? I have this design and it appears
> original
> > > (including a molded fiberglass cover for the output). It's in fine
shape
> > > still, but it came close to being trashed a few years ago when I
changed
> > my
> > > manifold and exhaust flange. I've had problems with exhaust systems on
> > other
> > > A4 equipped boats in the past and I'm sort of amazed that this system
> > might
> > > have lasted since 1972.
> > > Has anyone taken one of these apart and drawn up it's design and
how
> to
> > > build one? It appears fairly simple from the outside, but I'm curious
as
> > to
> > > the internal fittings, most especially the end of the actual exhaust
> pipe
> > > inside the water jacket and the end of the water injection at the top.
> > There
> > > must be some magic there since I've cranked my engine for quite a
while
> > > without it starting and I've never had any water get down to the
> manifold
> > or
> > > the #4 cylinder. There must be something that keeps the water from
going
> > > straight into the exhaust pipe. (water injection flows down and exhaus
t
> > pipe
> > > flows up, both perfectly in the middle of the larger standpipe)
> > > I'm curious since I know nothing lasts forever. This system appears
> > > original from almost 30 years ago. If I've ever got to replace it,
I'd
> > like
> > > to replace it in kind and not have to worry about it for another 30
> years.
> > > Has anyone tried this exhaust on an engine other than an A4? I'm so
> > > impressed with this design that I don't understand why water lift
> mufflers
> > > were ever designed!!
> > > Thanks and regards,
> > > Brian A30 #497 Free Spirit
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "George Dinwiddie" <gdinwiddie at min.net>
> > > To: <public-list at alberg30.org>
> > > Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2001 5:21 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [Alberg30] Exhaust Pipe
> > >
> > >
> > > > Chris,
> > > >
> > > > The exhaust pipe is generally black iron, though you can use bronze
> > > > pipe and some older systems are made of copper. As others have
said,
> > > > the bridgedeck location is not ideal for a compass. You can
> compensate
> > > > for the iron in the engine and exhaust, but you'll still need a
> > > > different deviation table when the engine's running, due to the
> > > > magnetic field of the electric currents.
> > > >
> > > > Many people have mounted compasses in the bulkheads. Some have
> mounted
> > > > the compass on the companionway slides. Our compass is mounted on a
> > > > board that slides into the companionway like a hatch board. It's a
> > > > bit of a nuisance to step over and you have to store it somewhere,
> > > > but it's a pretty simple solution.
> > > >
> > > > - George
> > > >
> > > > Christos Katehis wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Almost Exhausted in searching for the magnetic
> > > > > field.......................after purchase of new compass, I
> > > > > found it !
> > > > >
> > > > > What type of material is the exhaust pipe leaving the Atomic4
> > > > > supposed to be? Because the material that is now on #383 is
> > > > > affecting the compass. I guess it was re-done with the wrong
> > > > > material.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thank you,
> > > > > Chris Katehis
> > > > >
> > > > > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > > > > | http://www.alberg30.org/store/Galison.html |
> > > > > | Beautiful notecards of the sea, and other fine art. |
> > > > > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org
> > > > > http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> > > > > To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org
> > > > > Include command "unsubscribe <password>" in subject or body.
> > > > > Use command "help" for more options.
> > > >
> > > > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > > > | http://www.alberg30.org/store/Galison.html |
> > > > | Beautiful notecards of the sea, and other fine art. |
> > > > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org
> > > > http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> > > > To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org
> > > > Include command "unsubscribe <password>" in subject or body.
> > > > Use command "help" for more options.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > > | http://www.alberg30.org/store/Galison.html |
> > > | Beautiful notecards of the sea, and other fine art. |
> > > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org
> > > http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> > > To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org
> > > Include command "unsubscribe <password>" in subject or body.
> > > Use command "help" for more options.
> >
> >
> > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> > | http://www.alberg30.org/store/Galison.html |
> > | Beautiful notecards of the sea, and other fine art. |
> > +-----------------------------------------------------+
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org
> > http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> > To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org
> > Include command "unsubscribe <password>" in subject or body.
> > Use command "help" for more options.
> >
> >
>
> +------------------------------------------------------------------+
> | Simrad TP20 w/ FREE remote, on sale at Sailnet. Search "SIMTP20" |
> | http://www.myaffiliateprogram.com/u/sailnet/t.asp?id=1066 |
> +------------------------------------------------------------------+
>
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org
> Include command "unsubscribe <password>" in subject or body.
> Use command "help" for more options.
+------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Simrad TP20 w/ FREE remote, on sale at Sailnet. Search "SIMTP20" |
| http://www.myaffiliateprogram.com/u/sailnet/t.asp?id=1066 |
+------------------------------------------------------------------+
_______________________________________________
Public-list mailing list -- Public-list at alberg30.org
http://www.alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
To unsubscribe: email to Public-list-request at alberg30.org
Include command "unsubscribe <password>" in subject or body.
Use command "help" for more options.
991370922.0
More information about the Public-List
mailing list