[Public-List] Check that standing rigging-- especially this kind of terminal

Glenn via Public-List public-list at lists.alberg30.org
Tue Jul 15 09:44:21 PDT 2014 

Typically when you swage wire you should turn the wire around a thimble or deadeye of some kind.  I don't know what the recommended bending radius should be , I suspect it's 5 to 1 or better.   that takes the bending stress off the wire, hence the wire strands don't break before their time.  If 5:1, 1/4'' wire would be turned around a 1 1/4" thimble.  

BTW,  I heard the wire manufacturers recommend replacing wire Every seven years, although a San Francisco rigging shop that does a lot of Pacific Cup and Transpac Race boats said they have seem some serviceable wire that was 12 years old- which they replaced.  A guy on a Cal 25 next to me in the Marina has 25 year old wire - nothing's broke yet he says,  waiting for next year to replace!  Iam thinking Wow, how's that for living on the edge.

Glenn
Dolce 318

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 15, 2014, at 8:06 AM, Gordon Laco via Public-List <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
> 
> They're still used in architectural and commercial marine applications, both
> fields where their integrity is trusted.
> 
> Mike's correct about the turn' but of course one can inspect the strands in
> the turn.
> 
> Surprise has nicropress's at the top of her all her shrouds.  The forestay
> and backstay have been replaced; I swaged them.  I use Blue Wave swageless
> terminals on the bottoms.
> 
> Gord #426 Surprise
> 
> 
> On 15/07/14 10:55 AM, "Mike Lehman via Public-List"
> <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
> 
>> Randy
>> 
>> Glenn is correct. The nicro press fittings don't fail. It is not desired
>> because the wire needs to make a tight turn and eventually a strand in the
>> wire breaks...that requires immediate attention.
>> 
>> Mike Lehman
>> 
>> 
>> ------ Original message------
>> From: Glenn Brooks via Public-List
>> Date: Mon, Jul 14, 2014 6:43 PM
>> To: Randy Katz;Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all;
>> Subject:Re: [Public-List] Check that standing rigging-- especially this kind
>> of terminal
>> Hi Randy,  your paint job sounds like it came out nice.  These nico press
>> fittings and thimble ends were the only wire you could get in Alaska during
>> the 70's and 80's- widely used and made up with no issues on hundreds if not
>> thousands of sailboats and commercial fishing boats.  No one had swaging
>> machines locally in those days, so this is all you could get.   My old 62'
>> wood ketch was rigged this way, and also had some really old hand made wire
>> splices looped around the mast.  The thimbles and swagged fittings never
>> failed, even when the wire strands started to break.  It's probably good to
>> change them out, but there is plenty of history of successful service with
>> this design and I am sure you where never at risk - whereas swayed fittings
>> (shipped in from Seattle) of that era failed regularly at a given age, and
>> probably still do.   Sta lok or hi mod are undoubtedly superior to all, even
>> though more way expensive.
>> 
>> BTW, I saw a guy in Everett Marina today working on some sailboat masthead
>> with a small boom truck and gantry.  Owner was sunning himself on the deck
>> whilst the guy in the gantry replaced wires.  So at least one local rigger
>> makes house calls.
>> 
>> Glenn
>> Dolce 318
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Jul 14, 2014, at 2:49 PM, Randy Katz via Public-List
>>> <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Greetings, All,
>>> 
>>> Besides the painting upgrade, I was able to meet up with Don Yager of Yager
>>> Sails  (in Spokane, WA. at http://www.yagersails.com/). He makes occasional
>>> trips to Bellingham where we keep the boat, this time to deliver a new sail
>>> to a customer there. He generously offered to take a look at my Profurl set
>>> up to advise re: the life expectancy of the forestay.
>>> 
>>> The forestay's good for a few more years, but he pointed out one thing that
>>> I was REALLY glad to hear about-- this is especially relevant to some of us
>>> with older boats. (Well, I guess that's ALL of us, eh?)
>>> 
>>> While the lower ends of all the rigging had a variation of a Norseman
>>> mechanical compression fitting, the upper ends nearly all consist of wire
>>> wrapped around a SS thimble and crimped with Nico-press types of fitting.
>>> Don declared these to be no-no's and dangerous, to replace right away. This
>>> thought was seconded by Pete, the rigging expert at Fishery Supply in
>>> Seattle. Raised eyebrows all around!
>>> 
>>> So, we're dropping the mast tomorrow in order to remove all that stuff and
>>> replace it with wire from Fisheries Supply. Chinese-made wire is,
>>> apparently, to be completely avoided. US-made is best, though it can be
>>> hard to find. (I checked with a dozen places in western WA and found one or
>>> two sources: West Marine-- expensive-- and NW Rigging in Anacortes at about
>>> half the price. Let me know if you'd like a copy of my notes about this. Or
>>> photos of the fittings.)
>>> 
>>> We're going with Fishery Supplies Korean wire made by KOS but stranded
>>> together in the US. A good reputation, supposedly.
>>> 
>>> You may want to check you own rigging to be sure you don't have those
>>> crimped terminals. (The rigging is not original; it spent some years in
>>> Portland, OR. before I bought it in 2000.)
>>> 
>>> This puts the sailing trip back another week, but heck, I'm glad to know of
>>> it. I can only imagine how lucky we've been, having sailed through all
>>> kinds of weather with those fittings over the last dozen years!
>>> 
>>> Best Regards,
>>> 
>>> Randy Katz
>>> #249 Simple Gifts
>>> Bellingham/Seattle
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