[Public-List] What wood....

Tue Feb 16 07:47:36 PST 2016

Thanks Don - 

I am planning on a scaffold, that's good advice - but will only do one side
of the boat at a time...  And I've had great success doing multiple
applications of epoxy by re-applying subsequent coats on previous semi-cured
'green' layers.  

Cheers - 

Gord #426 Surprise

On 2016-02-16, 10:40 AM, "Don Campbell" <dk.campbell at xplornet.ca> wrote:

> Gord:
>      Before I had used epoxies, I had a discussion with a craftsman from
> Niagara-on-the-Lake who went by the name of "Scotty". He still had the
> accent to match! His advice to me was that for any major epoxy job, build a
> full scaffold that completely encircles the boat and have it so you can walk
> around the whole thing without getting down.  I did this for the deck job
> that I have done on 528, and it made all the difference between a job done
> and a good job. Having the ability to get your eyes to the surface and
> change positions to see the variability of the surface makes all the
> difference in the finished product.  Consider a scaffold seriously.
>     One thing I have found working with epoxy is that being very careful
> with how much one puts on at one time is critical. Having some dexterity
> with scrapers and brushes makes for easy choices when it comes to uniform
> application of materials (without disturbing the glass cloth). The more
> careful one is, the less one has to remove once it goes hard. The difference
> in hardeners makes for some difference in pot life and working time.
> Thickeners may make the material not as strong and much more difficult to
> sand away excess.  Sometimes I wised for better self levelers within the mix
> and bubbles are anathema. Stirring the mix is a real art to get a mixing
> without incorporating air that makes bubbles which do not come out very
> easily. Personally I have found West system to be good , but MAS gives you
> much more to choose from for hardeners and cure time.
>     Another real help is to have 4 hands for big jobs. One person mixes and
> the other applies it. It makes for more uniform materials quickly at hand,
> and much more uniform lay-up because of the faster availability, and with
> fewer ridges from joining to batches that have partially cured. The end
> result is less extra material to remove as well.  Four hands also help when
> you want to add a second layer just at the time when the first has set but
> not blushed or gone waxy, again because it means that the person applying
> materials can make the decision to add without having to take time away to
> mix materials.
> Don
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gordon Laco via Public-List
> Sent: Tuesday, February 16, 2016 8:08 AM
> To: Lawrence Morris ; Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
> Subject: Re: [Public-List] What wood....
> 
> When I tackle this job, my latest thinking is that I will not disturb the
> pop rivets.  The new bolts securing the toe rail will supply integrity to
> the hull to deck joint, and quite sufficient I think.
> 
> The old rivets will be buried beneath the new epoxy/cloth job which will be
> laid over the new caulking along the deck edge and rivet heads.
> 
> Surprise is #426, being of the later style of deck construction.  Rather
> than a wooden toe rail, she has the moulded in mini-bulwark upon which the
> wood serves as a finishing cap rail.
> 
> I think the only part of the job which will be finicky will be the removal
> and replacement of the genoa sheet track on the port side where I've
> installed a second fuel tank. I can get a wrench in over the tank, but can't
> see.  I suppose I could remove the tank then replace it again;  I'll see how
> it goes.   The potentially messy part of the job is the epoxy/cloth job.  I
> do not want to run epoxy down over my nice topsides paint job.  I'm thinking
> I'm going to build a 'dam' of premium grade masking tape with which to
> confine the muck until it cures.   I'll run the tape on both inside and
> outside edges of the moulded toe rail and will also thicken the epoxy so it
> is a little less runny.  And of course I'll patrol the work until it's
> safely solidified enough not to run.
> 
> I'm not so fond of epoxy work... I was making a new forehatch for Touch
> Wood, the Folkboat, yesterday.  I remarked to myself yet again that wood
> work looks just as beautiful in the building stages as when completed and
> that tends to boost ones morale. Epoxy and glass work usually looks like
> hell until the final finish is applied. I am usually in a state of impatient
> near panic fearing I've made a mess....
> 
> Onwards,
> 
> Gord #426 Surprise
> 
> 
> On 2016-02-15, 1:56 PM, "Lawrence Morris via Public-List"
> <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
> 
>> Greg,
>> 
>> Remember whatever wood type you choose. Those bolts holding down the toe
>> rail
>> also are the main fastener system holding the hull to deck joint together.
>> Plan well and be careful when removing reinstalling the toe rail.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Larry
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On Feb 15, 2016, at 7:34 AM, Greg Dawson via Public-List
>>> <public-list at lists.alberg30.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi Guys
>>> 
>>> Alternatives to teak? The woodwork on our boat is in poor shape, the
>>> hatch
>>> covers are falling to pieces and the toe rail has been cut in a couple of
>>> places. The teak trim on the stern is snapped in two and the boards
>>> either
>>> side of the cockpit are badly weathered. To add to this the mild steel
>>> bolts
>>> holding our toe rail down are so rusted that they are snapping when you
>>> try
>>> to adjust them.
>>> 
>>> I'm looking to replace the toe rail with an aluminum system once I find
>>> something appropriate, does anyone have any ideas? Also, replacement teak
>>> for
>>> the hatches etc is simply out of our price range (lots of other stuff to
>>> buy
>>> with that money) and I am looking at alternatives, any ideas? Is there
>>> any
>>> reason for instance that I can't use ash or cherry provided that I accept
>>> the
>>> additional work of varnishing each season?
>>> 
>>> Finally, on the subject of mast beams, is there an engineered drawing
>>> kicking
>>> around that I could work off to produce my new beam. Currently it has the
>>> Frankenstein bolts and aluminum plates. Nothing is quite lining up as it
>>> should and I am wary of using the damaged beam as a template. I have to
>>> renew
>>> the bulkheads as they are rotten around the chain plates so I might as
>>> well
>>> do the beam to at the same time. Any ideas?
>>> 
>>> Thanks
>>> 
>>> Greg.
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> 
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