[Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
John Kennedy
John.Kennedy at gov.ab.ca
Thu Oct 28 14:50:37 PDT 2004
Mike Lehman wrote:
"Tell her to sleep in the cockpit."
Thanks, Mike. I betcha you'll be right behind me when I tell her that. About
5 miles behind me! <grin>
Michael Connolly contributed this, which raises a question:
"Might just be easier to purchase one of those 'wider' boats and let
the Albergs be for the more adventuresome skinny people."
Michael: can you suggest a worthy "wider" boat which is of Alberg-type
quality? I know that Alberg's aren't the *only* good boats in the world -
they're just the only good boats *I* know of!
Turns out, on further chatting with my sweetie, that her real objection was
to the poor construction of the V-berth insert supports, which allowed the
insert to fall out at least twice per night. I think that problem would be
readily solved.
She also wants something suitably raised to step down onto, and slightly
more stable than a Rubbermaid stool. I think a removable wooden step could
be fabricated as well.
My first thought (not having finished restoring the Fireball and merely
dreaming about the Alberg) would be to laminate 2 horizontal supports with
epoxy (perhaps 1x3?) and attach them to the sides of the notch in the
V-berth, either epoxied, through-bolted, or both. I'd laminate so that the
supports won't be affected by shrinking or swelling as much as a plain piece
of hardwood.
Then, I think I'd cut 2 slanting dovetails into each notch, to accept a
matching shape on each of two cross-supports for under the insert. (I'd line
the joints with sheet brass, I think, for wear protection.) The joint would
be similar to that sometimes used to join frames to keels on wooden boats.
That way, as weight and gravity acted on the joint, the joints would become
tighter, not looser, thus less inclined to fall out. I'd add a hook or
barrel bolt to stop the insert from falling down if the boat became
inverted. That way, I wouldn't fall out of bed if the boat rolls! <grin>
Any comments on the practicality of any of the above.
-----Original Message-----
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
(Michael Connolly)
2. RE: mainsail reefing (Bob)
3. Re: "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
(Roger L. Kingsland)
4. Re: "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
(Michael Connolly)
5. Re: "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative? (John Irving)
6. Re: "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative? (Mike Lehman)
7. Re: "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
(Michael Connolly)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 09:57:41 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Connolly <crufone at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the
alternative?
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
Message-ID: <20041028165741.7411.qmail at web81001.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hello,
I was thinking about fabricating a removable filler between the two main
cabin berths. Was planning on using table brackets mounted on both trim
pieces on the outside of each of the berths, (wooden cleats could also be
installed). A sturdy panel would then be supported on each side by the
table brackets. Main issue is how to store the panel and mattress when not
in use.
Michael
Gail DeMoss <gdemoss at alberg30.org> wrote:
Some A30 owners have inserted a "fill", in the main cabin, across the
cabin to connect the two seats. The back cushions are then used to make
the "double bed". Maybe someone who has done this can explain it better.
I am not crazy about the V-berth for sleeping. Too hard to get in and
out and I am always whacking my head, elbows, knees or sticking a foot
in Georges back, face, stomach, etc.
Gail Dinwiddie
Calypso #543
John Kennedy wrote:
> My spouse remarked the other day that "I will NOT sleep in a V-berth
again!"
>
> Can anyone make some useful suggestions on double-sized sleeping
> arrangements, preferably of the aft-cabin sort, and the boats that
surround
> them?
>
> Thanks, everyone.
>
> John
>
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:15:03 -0300
From: Bob <bob at fox.nstn.ca>
Subject: RE: [Public-list] mainsail reefing
To: 'Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all' <public-list at alberg30.org>
Message-ID: <000c01c4bd11$aa00a840$78010a0a at bobc>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hi John,
I have the outer turning blocks (at outer end of boom) for the reef lines
and cleats on the starboard side of the boom.
My preference is that I would rather be on a starboard tack (especially when
racing) when putting a first or second reef in.
My guess is that you're not racing when you put a second reef in!
I would prefer and hopefully not have to give way to another boat while
getting caught putting a reef in while on starboard tack.
The boat can be reefed while on either tack but easier while on starboard
tack.
Instead of having cleats on the mast end of the boom for the reef lines,
Double Spinlocks with a winch on the mast end of the boom is "really nice"
to winch the first or second reef line in but it adds to the cost of the
whole setup.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Bob
A30 #560
-----Original Message-----
From: public-list-bounces at alberg30.org
[mailto:public-list-bounces at alberg30.org] On Behalf Of James Schueler
Sent: October 28, 2004 11:50 AM
To: public-list at alberg30.org
Subject: [Public-list] mainsail reefing
Hello all,
Would someone be able to explain in detail how to set up reefing for the
main? Cringles and grommets are in place on the sail and cleats and
fairleads on the boom but I'm not too sure of the proper way to run the
lines. I've seen pictures where it appears the reefing lines run under
and around the boom. I know I didn't have my last boat set up that way
so I'm a bit confused.
Thanks,
James Schueler
"Oddyseus" #170
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 13:29:17 -0400
From: "Roger L. Kingsland" <rkingsland101 at ksba.com>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the
alternative?
To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all" <public-list at alberg30.org>
Message-ID: <021501c4bd13$a708b310$9c00a8c0 at office.ksba>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Michael,
One thought I had but have not confirmed is doable is to hinge the panel at
the forward end so it can be placed in a vertical position when someone
wants to exit the berth. Of course, in that position, it would get wider as
it gets taller and the question is would it block access to the forward ends
of the V berths too much.
I saw a photograph somewhere of the removable cabin table stored against the
overhead at the forward end of the V berth. This could also be a good place
to store "the wedge." If I ever install an anchor locker hatch at the
pointy end, it will be possible to use this space (above your feet) for
additional shelf or locker space which could go down to about 14" above the
cushion and extend about 18" aft of the forward bulkhead.
Roger Kingsland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Connolly" <crufone at sbcglobal.net>
To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all" <public-list at alberg30.org>
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
> Hello,
> I was thinking about fabricating a removable filler between the two main
cabin berths. Was planning on using table brackets mounted on both trim
pieces on the outside of each of the berths, (wooden cleats could also be
installed). A sturdy panel would then be supported on each side by the
table brackets. Main issue is how to store the panel and mattress when not
in use.
> Michael
>
> Gail DeMoss <gdemoss at alberg30.org> wrote:
> Some A30 owners have inserted a "fill", in the main cabin, across the
> cabin to connect the two seats. The back cushions are then used to make
> the "double bed". Maybe someone who has done this can explain it better.
>
> I am not crazy about the V-berth for sleeping. Too hard to get in and
> out and I am always whacking my head, elbows, knees or sticking a foot
> in Georges back, face, stomach, etc.
>
> Gail Dinwiddie
> Calypso #543
>
>
>
> John Kennedy wrote:
> > My spouse remarked the other day that "I will NOT sleep in a V-berth
again!"
> >
> > Can anyone make some useful suggestions on double-sized sleeping
> > arrangements, preferably of the aft-cabin sort, and the boats that
surround
> > them?
> >
> > Thanks, everyone.
> >
> > John
>
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:57:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Connolly <crufone at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the
alternative?
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
Message-ID: <20041028175721.62098.qmail at web81007.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Roger,
I guess that I would rather use a piano hinge so that the platform would
fold in half for storage. One could, in addition, have a fore and aft
section each that would also fold in half. Thus the folding platforms might
be only 18" by 36" by 2" thick. One would have two of these that could more
easily be stored on board. I was imagining this arrangement to be set up
only when needed at sleep time and then disassembled and put up when
underway. When set up it would make it very ackward to get around the main
cabin.
Oh yes, another possibility would be to make two panels of appropriate
length, that would be supported by cross members in either cleats or
brackets. These panels could then be stored under the seatee cushions one
on each side and the cross members in the drawers underneath the seatees?
The major consideration in my book would be to design the support brackets
on the inside of the seatee trim to not be dangerious protrusions that could
cause injury when not in use.
I am sure that others on this list have worked this arrangement out and can
comment further.
Michael
"Roger L. Kingsland" <rkingsland101 at ksba.com> wrote:
Michael,
One thought I had but have not confirmed is doable is to hinge the panel at
the forward end so it can be placed in a vertical position when someone
wants to exit the berth. Of course, in that position, it would get wider as
it gets taller and the question is would it block access to the forward ends
of the V berths too much.
I saw a photograph somewhere of the removable cabin table stored against the
overhead at the forward end of the V berth. This could also be a good place
to store "the wedge." If I ever install an anchor locker hatch at the
pointy end, it will be possible to use this space (above your feet) for
additional shelf or locker space which could go down to about 14" above the
cushion and extend about 18" aft of the forward bulkhead.
Roger Kingsland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Connolly"
To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all"
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
> Hello,
> I was thinking about fabricating a removable filler between the two main
cabin berths. Was planning on using table brackets mounted on both trim
pieces on the outside of each of the berths, (wooden cleats could also be
installed). A sturdy panel would then be supported on each side by the
table brackets. Main issue is how to store the panel and mattress when not
in use.
> Michael
>
> Gail DeMoss wrote:
> Some A30 owners have inserted a "fill", in the main cabin, across the
> cabin to connect the two seats. The back cushions are then used to make
> the "double bed". Maybe someone who has done this can explain it better.
>
> I am not crazy about the V-berth for sleeping. Too hard to get in and
> out and I am always whacking my head, elbows, knees or sticking a foot
> in Georges back, face, stomach, etc.
>
> Gail Dinwiddie
> Calypso #543
>
>
>
> John Kennedy wrote:
> > My spouse remarked the other day that "I will NOT sleep in a V-berth
again!"
> >
> > Can anyone make some useful suggestions on double-sized sleeping
> > arrangements, preferably of the aft-cabin sort, and the boats that
surround
> > them?
> >
> > Thanks, everyone.
> >
> > John
>
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
>
>
_______________________________________________
Public-list mailing list
Public-list at alberg30.org
http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:08:39 -0400
From: John Irving <a30blueteal at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the
alternative?
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
Message-ID: <3415472504102811086ebbc27a at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
James Baldwin made a sliding double berth on his Triton.
Check the last four images on this page:
http://www.atomvoyages.com/projects/atomprojects2.htm
On Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:57:21 -0700 (PDT), Michael Connolly
<crufone at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> Roger,
> I guess that I would rather use a piano hinge so that the platform would
fold in half for storage. One could, in addition, have a fore and aft
section each that would also fold in half. Thus the folding platforms might
be only 18" by 36" by 2" thick. One would have two of these that could more
easily be stored on board. I was imagining this arrangement to be set up
only when needed at sleep time and then disassembled and put up when
underway. When set up it would make it very ackward to get around the main
cabin.
>
> Oh yes, another possibility would be to make two panels of appropriate
length, that would be supported by cross members in either cleats or
brackets. These panels could then be stored under the seatee cushions one
on each side and the cross members in the drawers underneath the seatees?
>
> The major consideration in my book would be to design the support brackets
on the inside of the seatee trim to not be dangerious protrusions that could
cause injury when not in use.
>
> I am sure that others on this list have worked this arrangement out and
can comment further.
>
> Michael
>
>
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:17:20 -0400
From: "Mike Lehman" <sail_505 at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the
alternative?
To: public-list at alberg30.org
Message-ID: <BAY15-F4m5R4r3mbfJ800039e3c at hotmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed
Tell her to sleep in the cockpit. One cold night, with rain and mosquitos
and she will gladly slepp in the v-berth again.
Mike Lehman
><((((o>,.*??`*...,><((((o>
----Original Message Follows----
From: Michael Connolly <crufone at sbcglobal.net>
Reply-To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:57:21 -0700 (PDT)
Roger,
I guess that I would rather use a piano hinge so that the platform would
fold in half for storage. One could, in addition, have a fore and aft
section each that would also fold in half. Thus the folding platforms might
be only 18" by 36" by 2" thick. One would have two of these that could more
easily be stored on board. I was imagining this arrangement to be set up
only when needed at sleep time and then disassembled and put up when
underway. When set up it would make it very ackward to get around the main
cabin.
Oh yes, another possibility would be to make two panels of appropriate
length, that would be supported by cross members in either cleats or
brackets. These panels could then be stored under the seatee cushions one
on each side and the cross members in the drawers underneath the seatees?
The major consideration in my book would be to design the support brackets
on the inside of the seatee trim to not be dangerious protrusions that could
cause injury when not in use.
I am sure that others on this list have worked this arrangement out and can
comment further.
Michael
"Roger L. Kingsland" <rkingsland101 at ksba.com> wrote:
Michael,
One thought I had but have not confirmed is doable is to hinge the panel at
the forward end so it can be placed in a vertical position when someone
wants to exit the berth. Of course, in that position, it would get wider as
it gets taller and the question is would it block access to the forward ends
of the V berths too much.
I saw a photograph somewhere of the removable cabin table stored against the
overhead at the forward end of the V berth. This could also be a good place
to store "the wedge." If I ever install an anchor locker hatch at the
pointy end, it will be possible to use this space (above your feet) for
additional shelf or locker space which could go down to about 14" above the
cushion and extend about 18" aft of the forward bulkhead.
Roger Kingsland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Connolly"
To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all"
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
> Hello,
> I was thinking about fabricating a removable filler between the two main
cabin berths. Was planning on using table brackets mounted on both trim
pieces on the outside of each of the berths, (wooden cleats could also be
installed). A sturdy panel would then be supported on each side by the
table brackets. Main issue is how to store the panel and mattress when not
in use.
> Michael
>
> Gail DeMoss wrote:
> Some A30 owners have inserted a "fill", in the main cabin, across the
> cabin to connect the two seats. The back cushions are then used to make
> the "double bed". Maybe someone who has done this can explain it better.
>
> I am not crazy about the V-berth for sleeping. Too hard to get in and
> out and I am always whacking my head, elbows, knees or sticking a foot
> in Georges back, face, stomach, etc.
>
> Gail Dinwiddie
> Calypso #543
>
>
>
> John Kennedy wrote:
> > My spouse remarked the other day that "I will NOT sleep in a V-berth
again!"
> >
> > Can anyone make some useful suggestions on double-sized sleeping
> > arrangements, preferably of the aft-cabin sort, and the boats that
surround
> > them?
> >
> > Thanks, everyone.
> >
> > John
>
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
>
>
_______________________________________________
Public-list mailing list
Public-list at alberg30.org
http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
_______________________________________________
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Public-list at alberg30.org
http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 14:02:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Michael Connolly <crufone at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the
alternative?
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all <public-list at alberg30.org>
Message-ID: <20041028210247.58101.qmail at web81005.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Mike,
I suppose that proposition was in your prenuptial
agreement.....................otherwise....... :-o, :-o
Might just be easier to purchase one of those 'wider' boats and let the
Albergs be for the more adventuresome skinny people.
Michael
Mike Lehman <sail_505 at hotmail.com> wrote:
Tell her to sleep in the cockpit. One cold night, with rain and mosquitos
and she will gladly slepp in the v-berth again.
Mike Lehman
><((((o>,.*??`*...,><((((o>
----Original Message Follows----
From: Michael Connolly
Reply-To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
To: Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 10:57:21 -0700 (PDT)
Roger,
I guess that I would rather use a piano hinge so that the platform would
fold in half for storage. One could, in addition, have a fore and aft
section each that would also fold in half. Thus the folding platforms might
be only 18" by 36" by 2" thick. One would have two of these that could more
easily be stored on board. I was imagining this arrangement to be set up
only when needed at sleep time and then disassembled and put up when
underway. When set up it would make it very ackward to get around the main
cabin.
Oh yes, another possibility would be to make two panels of appropriate
length, that would be supported by cross members in either cleats or
brackets. These panels could then be stored under the seatee cushions one
on each side and the cross members in the drawers underneath the seatees?
The major consideration in my book would be to design the support brackets
on the inside of the seatee trim to not be dangerious protrusions that could
cause injury when not in use.
I am sure that others on this list have worked this arrangement out and can
comment further.
Michael
"Roger L. Kingsland" wrote:
Michael,
One thought I had but have not confirmed is doable is to hinge the panel at
the forward end so it can be placed in a vertical position when someone
wants to exit the berth. Of course, in that position, it would get wider as
it gets taller and the question is would it block access to the forward ends
of the V berths too much.
I saw a photograph somewhere of the removable cabin table stored against the
overhead at the forward end of the V berth. This could also be a good place
to store "the wedge." If I ever install an anchor locker hatch at the
pointy end, it will be possible to use this space (above your feet) for
additional shelf or locker space which could go down to about 14" above the
cushion and extend about 18" aft of the forward bulkhead.
Roger Kingsland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Connolly"
To: "Alberg 30 Public List -- open to all"
Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Public-list] "No V-berth", she says. What's the alternative?
> Hello,
> I was thinking about fabricating a removable filler between the two main
cabin berths. Was planning on using table brackets mounted on both trim
pieces on the outside of each of the berths, (wooden cleats could also be
installed). A sturdy panel would then be supported on each side by the
table brackets. Main issue is how to store the panel and mattress when not
in use.
> Michael
>
> Gail DeMoss wrote:
> Some A30 owners have inserted a "fill", in the main cabin, across the
> cabin to connect the two seats. The back cushions are then used to make
> the "double bed". Maybe someone who has done this can explain it better.
>
> I am not crazy about the V-berth for sleeping. Too hard to get in and
> out and I am always whacking my head, elbows, knees or sticking a foot
> in Georges back, face, stomach, etc.
>
> Gail Dinwiddie
> Calypso #543
>
>
>
> John Kennedy wrote:
> > My spouse remarked the other day that "I will NOT sleep in a V-berth
again!"
> >
> > Can anyone make some useful suggestions on double-sized sleeping
> > arrangements, preferably of the aft-cabin sort, and the boats that
surround
> > them?
> >
> > Thanks, everyone.
> >
> > John
>
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
> _______________________________________________
> Public-list mailing list
> Public-list at alberg30.org
> http://alberg30.org/mailman/listinfo/public-list
>
>
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------------------------------
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