[Public-List] Stoves.. and a note about propane

[George Dinwiddie]

I looked at the ABYC standards for galley stoves, 
http://www.abycinc.org/committees/A-03.pdf  (These are from 2000; the 
current edition of the standards cost money.)  These standards apply to 
boat manufacturers and to people doing work for others.  They don't 
directly apply to boat owners, who are allowed to blow themselves up if 
they want.  If you check your insurance, however, you may likely not be 
covered if you violate these standards.

Since Coleman fuel is effectively a light purified gasoline, I believe 
they're forbidden by the standard:

A-3.7.1	Appliances using gasoline in a liquid or solid form for priming 
or fuel are prohibited.

Butane and propane stoves are covered by these provisions:

A-3.8.1	Burner controls shall be equipped or designed to require a 
push-turn or other two-step operation when going from the off to on 
position.

A-3.8.2	All gaseous fueled stoves and ovens shall have a flame failure 
device on all burners and pilot lights.

A-3.8.3	Stoves	shall	meet	the	combustion requirements of ANSI Z 21.57, 
Recreational Vehicle Gas Cooking Appliances.

This ANSI standard can generally be verified by checking the UL 
certification.  (See http://bit.ly/axE0LP )  You can also check that the 
knob requires two movements to turn on and that the gas is shut off when 
the flame is blown out.

Note that NSI Z21.57 covers Recreational vehicle cooking gas appliances
and ANSI Z21.58/ CSA 1.6 covers outdoor cooking gas appliances
and ANSI Z21.72/ CSA 11.2 covers Portable type gas camp stoves.  It's 
possible for a single stove to meet more than one of these requirements. 
  This means it's /possible/ for a camp stove to be acceptable on a boat 
(in the US, at least), but you'll have to check carefully.

Of course, what's permitted and what's done are often two different 
things.  I noticed that Practical Sailor 
(http://www.practical-sailor.com/marine/Compact-Galley-Stoves.html) said:

"For gaseous stoves with fuel sources weighing more than 8 ounces and 
are planned for galley use, the ABYC requires a flame-failure device 
that stops fuel flow once the flame is extinguished. The only stove in 
our test with the device is the Kenyon KISS cooktop. The butane stoves 
use 7.8- or 8-ounce canisters, and the sea swings are not recommended 
for use down below. The standard does not apply to liquid-fueled stoves 
like the Origo. We tested the shutoff on the KISS by igniting the stove, 
blowing out the flame, and observing the time it took to stop the fuel 
flow."

and "According to the ABYC, gaseous galley stoves must have a two-step 
ignition process (a push-turn or something similar). The Chef-Master 
requires only a simple turn of the temperature control knob to light. It 
was the only test stove lacking the two-step ignition."

Personally, I would worry about the connection of the propane bottle to 
the stove on many of the camp stoves I've seen.  The rigid tube offers a 
long lever that could cause connections to be stressed and leak.  At 
least, that's my fear.

I /do/ use a cheap tabletop gas grill on the boat.  It has a direct 
connection for the gas bottle, I use it on deck, and I remove the gas 
bottle when not in use (storing the gas in a bag on the stern rail).  I 
feel pretty comfortable with that use and, at $14, I can replace the 
stove when it rusts out.

Down below I use a butane stove.  I know it takes a two-step motion to 
turn on, but I don't know if it has the flame-failure feature.  Given 
what Practical Sailor says about the Kenyon Express II, probably not, 
even though it was sold as a marine stove.  I store these bottles on the 
stern rail also, though I've heard it's permitted to store one below.

  - George


Dennis K. Biby wrote:
> How does a propane Coleman stove on deck differ from the propane BBQ grill
> on the rail?
> 
> If they leak, either one under the proper wind conditions can send propane
> to the bilge where it can mix with the gasoline from a leaky A-4.
> 
> Having used pressurized alcohol stoves, propane stoves, and Coleman stoves
> plus solid-fuel and electric heating stoves over many, many years of living
> aboard, it seems to me that life is prolonged by understanding the risks and
> taking the proper precautions and that life is enjoyed by not over-playing
> the what-ifs.
> 
> Just my 2-barnacles,
> 
> 
> Dennis
> s/v Ferrity
> 
> Visit MolokaiReef.com to learn more about my mystery novel:  Molokai Reef -
> Gybe Sails Hawaii.
> 
> 
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2010 at 4:02 PM, Gordon Laco <mainstay at csolve.net> wrote:
> 
>> I am sorry to suggest that the presence of a Coleman stove in a yacht is
>> another thing that would invalidate insurance if there were a fire.  They
>> are intended to be used only ashore where fuel vapour (highly explosive in
>> the case of that fuel) would safely dissipate away.  In a yacht, even up on
>> deck, the chances of it accumulating in the bilge or low in the cockpit are
>> great.
>>
>> Sorry to be offering bad news.
>>
>> Gord #426 SURPRISE
>>
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-- 
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   When I remember bygone days                         George Dinwiddie
   I think how evening follows morn;            gdinwiddie at alberg30.org
   So many I loved were not yet dead,           http://www.Alberg30.org
   So many I love were not yet born.                          also see:
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